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Discussion Groups | MSP430 | MSP340 compiler

The purpose of this group is to foster exchange of information on the Texas Instruments MSP430 family of microcontrollers and related tools. Everyone welcome, all levels of familiarity/expertise.

MSP340 compiler - magzky02 - Jan 25 5:38:45 2007

hello guys...I need some advice..

i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some practice
and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the commercial
version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.

DESCRIPTION PRICE
IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
+ DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650

IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?

thanks for advice

mago

Re: MSP340 compiler - Leon - Jan 25 6:47:49 2007

----- Original Message -----
From: "magzky02"
To:
Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 10:35 AM
Subject: [msp430] MSP340 compiler
>
> hello guys...I need some advice..
>
> i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some practice
> and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the commercial
> version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
>
> DESCRIPTION PRICE
> IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
> + DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
> Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650
>
> IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
> Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
> JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
> RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
> As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
> Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
> purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?

You could try the Rowley compiler, it's a lot cheaper and support is
excellent.

Leon
--
Leon Heller
Amateur radio call-sign G1HSM
Yaesu FT-817ND transceiver
Suzuki SV1000S motorcycle
l...@btinternet.com
http://webspace.webring.com/people/jl/leon_heller/

Re: MSP340 compiler - hal_lex_1 - Jan 25 7:30:11 2007

we use the crossworks from rowley, imo this compiler has the best
price/cost ratio with rly good service.

u can test it for 30 days though.

--- In m..., "magzky02" wrote:
> hello guys...I need some advice..
>
> i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some practice
> and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the commercial
> version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
>
> DESCRIPTION PRICE
> IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
> + DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
> Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650
>
> IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
> Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
> JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
> RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
> As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
> Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
> purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?
>
> thanks for advice
>
> mago
>


Re: MSP340 compiler - Microbit - Jan 25 7:49:32 2007

Watch out !

It's not until you've actually PAID for the tools you're told with a smirk that you need to pay
TWENTY % of the purchase price each year to receive ongoing "support". (I presume that's still the
same, that's what happened to me).
Like others stated, spend way less money and try Rowley's much superior CW430 CrossWorks.

-- Kris
From: m... [mailto:m...] On Behalf Of
magzky02
Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 4:36 AM
To: m...
Subject: [msp430] MSP340 compiler

hello guys...I need some advice..

i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some practice
and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the commercial
version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.

DESCRIPTION PRICE
IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
+ DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650

IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650

As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?

thanks for advice

mago

Re: MSP340 compiler - scottkassan - Jan 25 9:06:08 2007

I've also had very good results using AQ430 from quadravox/archelon.

http://www.quadravox.com/AQ430.htm
---
Scott Kassan
Senior Software Engineer
UAB/Center for Biophysical Sciences and Engineering
1530 3rd Ave S, Birmingham, AL 35294-4400
(205)975-2709

And Rowley's Macro Assembler is also better! - nfjensen123 - Jan 25 9:41:33 2007

The IAR Macro Assembler does not allow you to convert the value of
macro variables into strings. That may not seem like much but that
feature alone allows a macro to create labels and dynamic jumps. And
in doing so it is possible to extend the language significantly.

Even when I was on the 30 day trial, Paul provided amazing support.

I'd get a response within a day and they're usually asleep when we up.

Re: MSP340 compiler - fchambers01 - Jan 25 10:06:02 2007

--- In m..., "scottkassan" wrote:
>
> I've also had very good results using AQ430 from quadravox/archelon.
>
> http://www.quadravox.com/AQ430.htm
> ---
> Scott Kassan
> Senior Software Engineer
> UAB/Center for Biophysical Sciences and Engineering
> 1530 3rd Ave S, Birmingham, AL 35294-4400
> (205)975-2709
>
I've been using CCE for a substantial project and a number of smaller
ones. I started with version 1 which had a number of issues. It was
updated last year to 2.0 with substantial improvements. I have since
gone to the unlimited version of 2.0 and been quite pleased. I am
also very happy with the level of support that I have received from
TI. CCE costs less than any of the others and does the job quite
well. It is well worth considering. They too, offer a code size
limited, 8K, version as a download.

Frank

_____________________________
 Free pdf download: Beginning Microcontrollers with the MSP430.


Re: MSP340 compiler - Frank Chambers - Jan 25 11:55:37 2007

I've been using CCE for a substantial project and a number of smaller
ones. I started with version 1 which had a number of issues. It was
updated last year to 2.0 with substantial improvements. I have since
gone to the unlimited version of 2.0 and been quite pleased. I am also
very happy with the level of support that I have received from TI. CCE
costs less than any of the others and does the job quite well. It is
well worth considering. They too, offer a code size limited, 8K,
version as a download.

Frank

Microbit wrote:
>
> Watch out !
>
> It's not until you've actually PAID for the tools you're told with a
> smirk that you need to pay
> TWENTY % of the purchase price each year to receive ongoing "support".
> (I presume that's still the
> same, that's what happened to me).
> Like others stated, spend way less money and try Rowley's much
> superior CW430 CrossWorks.
>
> -- Kris
>
> From: m...
> [mailto:m... ] On
> Behalf Of
> magzky02
> Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 4:36 AM
> To: m...
> Subject: [msp430] MSP340 compiler
>
> hello guys...I need some advice..
>
> i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some practice
> and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the commercial
> version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
>
> DESCRIPTION PRICE
> IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
> + DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
> Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650
>
> IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
> Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
> JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
> RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
>
> As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
> Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
> purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?
>
> thanks for advice
>
> mago
>
>

--
Frank

This message and any attachments are confidential and intended solely for the addressees. If you receive this message in error, please delete it and immediately notify the sender. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unauthorized use, copying or dissemination is prohibited.

_____________________________
 Free pdf download: Beginning Microcontrollers with the MSP430.


Re: MSP340 compiler - Robert - Jan 25 17:40:57 2007

Hi,

I would never recommend IAR after the crummy support I have received
with the MSP430 compiler. Save some $'s, and lots of frustration,
buy something else.

--- In m..., "magzky02" wrote:
> hello guys...I need some advice..
>
> i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some
practice
> and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the
commercial
> version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
>
> DESCRIPTION PRICE
> IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
> + DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
> Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650
>
> IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
> Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
> JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
> RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
> As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
> Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
> purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?
>
> thanks for advice
>
> mago
>


Re: MSP340 compiler - mago Umandam - Jan 26 6:28:54 2007

I thank you all guys for the comments and advice. I'll evaluate the Rowley Crossworks for MSP430. seems more are recommending this.

mago

Robert wrote:
Hi,

I would never recommend IAR after the crummy support I have received
with the MSP430 compiler. Save some $'s, and lots of frustration,
buy something else.

--- In m..., "magzky02" wrote:
> hello guys...I need some advice..
>
> i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some
practice
> and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the
commercial
> version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
>
> DESCRIPTION PRICE
> IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
> + DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
> Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650
>
> IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
> Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
> JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
> RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
> As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
> Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
> purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?
>
> thanks for advice
>
> mago
>

---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

Re: MSP340 compiler - "b.lu" - Jan 26 9:18:29 2007

HI,
I use mspgcc (http://mspgcc.sourceforge.net) a free MSP430 C compiler.
In my opinion this compiler is excellent, generate great optimized code,
and is completely free. Moreover you can look at generated assembler and
all C features are supported such as naked functions, interrupts, inline
assembler, ...

If you also need an operating system look at
http://blubos.sourceforge.net, it is an open source completely free
operating system for MSP430 that support multitasking preemption.

Blu

_____________________________
 Free pdf download: Beginning Microcontrollers with the MSP430.


Re: MSP340 compiler - richard-lists - Jan 26 10:30:49 2007

Well, most vendors (ours included) have fully functional demos so you
should just test drive a few. Our
baseline compiler is only $200 and the debugger is $100. There are so many
choices that sometimes it's not even funny :-)
// richard

_____________________________
 Free pdf download: Beginning Microcontrollers with the MSP430.


Re: MSP340 compiler - Stuart_Rubin - Jan 26 11:06:25 2007

I have had great support from IAR. I definitely would not use their
support as a reason not to buy their tools. The price is high, but
you get what you pay for.

We had been using the ImageCraft compiler and NoIce debugger with some
success. We have products on the market which were developed with
them. The compiler lacks a few small features but compiles very nice,
tight code. The debugger is somewhat lacking in features and a little
quirky. The combination is a lot less expensive than IAR.

Is there anyone developing professionally (i.e. you're not a hobbyist
and need free tools) using GNU tools? That may be the solution for
the original poster in this thread.

Stuart

--- In m..., "Robert" wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I would never recommend IAR after the crummy support I have received
> with the MSP430 compiler. Save some $'s, and lots of frustration,
> buy something else.
>
>
>
> --- In m..., "magzky02" wrote:
> >
> >
> > hello guys...I need some advice..
> >
> > i bought a TI dev kit with IAR kickstart compiler. Did some
> practice
> > and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> > code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the
> commercial
> > version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
> >
> > DESCRIPTION PRICE
> > IAR Embedded WorkBench EW430-LE
> > + DGL-USB Embedded C/C++ Compiler,
> > Assembler, USB dongle, SGD$ 2,650
> >
> > IAR Embedded Workbench EW430-LE + DGL-USB
> > Embedded C/C++ Compiler, Assembler, Simulator,
> > JTAG Debugger software, USB dongle,
> > RTOS Plugin for CMX and UCOS-II SGD$ 3,650
> >
> >
> > As per note, there is SGD$ 1000 diference between the two package.
> > Would you think the 1st one is enough for development? What is the
> > purpose of the JTAG debugger saoftware?
> >
> > thanks for advice
> >
> > mago
>


Re: MSP340 compiler - Matt Pobursky - Jan 27 0:07:00 2007

On Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:49:28 -0000, Stuart_Rubin wrote:
> I have had great support from IAR. I definitely would not use
> their support as a reason not to buy their tools. The price is
> high, but you get what you pay for.

I would have to disagree about this. I've been a registered user of
two different IAR toolsets over the years (PIC and 68HC11) and found
their tech support to be slow in responding and bug fixes occur at
the rate of a glacial thaw. It often took a week or more to get
answers to (relatively) simple tech support questions and I found a
few bugs that took months or longer for them to fix.

Contrast this to my experience with Imagecraft, Quadravox and Rowley
Associates (Richard, Michel and Paul, respectively). I evaluated all
of their products and asked tech support questions of all of them. I
got responses from all of them within 24 hrs.

We currently use Quadravox AQ430 tools for our MSP430 development.
Support from Quadravox has been exceptional. Bug fixes often occur
the same day as reported. As a developer, I think quick bug fixes are
a crtical item in choosing a tool vendor -- especially when the bug
you've run across is a "show stopper".

We have also used Imagecraft's AVR tools, and while we ultimately
switched to the Rowley toolset, all our experiences with tech support
and bug fixes has been outstanding.

We currently use Rowley's AVR toolset and it is extremely good. Tech
support from them has also been exceptional. Object code size is the
best we've run across and ultimately was the reason for our switch
from the Imagecraft AVR toolset.

I would have no problem recommending *any* of these tool vendors as
an alternative to IAR.

> We had been using the ImageCraft compiler and NoIce debugger with
> some success. We have products on the market which were developed
> with them. The compiler lacks a few small features but compiles
> very nice, tight code. The debugger is somewhat lacking in
> features and a little quirky. The combination is a lot less
> expensive than IAR.

Agreed. The Imagecraft tools are certainly capable and a good value.

> Is there anyone developing professionally (i.e. you're not a
> hobbyist and need free tools) using GNU tools? That may be the
> solution for the original poster in this thread.

My biggest problem with the Gcc tools for microcontrollers is the
lack of a cohesive hardware debugger like virtually all the
commercial tool vendors include. I rarely use a simulator so I expect
the hardware debugger interface to be tightly coupled with the
compiler in the source level debugger.

I also question the code generator optimization for the MSP430 -- if
I recall correctly, someone here did a object code output comparison
between the commercial tools and MSP-Gcc and found that MSP-Gcc
produced the least optimized code. I'm not sure if this is still the
case, but I suspect it is.

Then there is the support issue -- while the user-based support for
Gcc tools is generally OK, you really don't have any way of knowing
how long a fix will take for a newly discovered bug.

I like the fact that open source, free tools exist for the MSP430 but
I don't think I want to rely on them for my commercial (paying)
development work -- especially when several reasonably priced and
well supported commercial toolsets are available.

Matt Pobursky
Maximum Performance Systems

Re: MSP340 compiler - kirkabailey - Jan 27 5:34:46 2007

I have to jump here and mention that I've been using the ImageCraft
professional compiler package for nearly a year and both the product
and support have been superb. I've used a lot of different
development tools over the years and I don't seem to get a chance to
say this sort of thing very often :)

Kirk Bailey

--- In m..., richard-lists wrote:
>
> Well, most vendors (ours included) have fully functional demos so you
> should just test drive a few. Our
> baseline compiler is only $200 and the debugger is $100. There are
so many
> choices that sometimes it's not even funny :-)
> // richard
>


Re: MSP340 compiler - Andreas Koepke - Jan 27 9:23:01 2007

> I also question the code generator optimization for the MSP430 -- if
> I recall correctly, someone here did a object code output comparison
> between the commercial tools and MSP-Gcc and found that MSP-Gcc
> produced the least optimized code. I'm not sure if this is still the
> case, but I suspect it is.

Most likely, but there were other comparisons that came to another
conclusion.

> Then there is the support issue -- while the user-based support for
> Gcc tools is generally OK, you really don't have any way of knowing
> how long a fix will take for a newly discovered bug.

Well, I'm working with it for nearly four years now. Yes, there are some
bugs (type size propagation and you should not use the hardware multiplier
for "internal stuff" like offset computation done by the compiler).
Other than these I did not manage to find bugs. There is currently no
support.

It also comes with a debugger that works. Sometimes I do miss
the printf debug facility to track how some state came about. With the
latest version, backtracing does not work. It does with older ones.

> I like the fact that open source, free tools exist for the MSP430 but
> I don't think I want to rely on them for my commercial (paying)
> development work -- especially when several reasonably priced and
> well supported commercial toolsets are available.

Agreed. Most of our stuff is within tinyos -- one of the thousands of OSs
for the MSP430. Since it is used by a whole bunch of people, drivers exist
for peripheral chips (mostly flash, radio, sensors and serial comm.).

Best, Andreas

> Matt Pobursky
> Maximum Performance Systems


Re: MSP340 compiler - martin_schoenegg - Jan 29 13:28:16 2007

Hi,
> and familiarization with MSP430. Now that i want to make a longer
> code (more than 4K), i need the comercial version but the
commercial
> version is damn expensive. i got this info from supplier.
> ...SGD$ 2,650
> ...SGD$ 3,650

There is mspgcc around too. For such which are familiar with gcc and/
or eclipse, this may be a good decision too. Forthose who looks on
the price, too.

Martin

Re: MSP340 compiler - dl3daz - Jan 29 14:39:22 2007

Hello,
this is my forst post to this group.

--- In m..., "Stuart_Rubin" wrote:

...

> Is there anyone developing professionally (i.e. you're not a hobbyist
> and need free tools) using GNU tools?

I am using mspgcc. The reason is quite simple: I am porting a project
from AVR to MSP430. I have been using avr-gcc before, so
msp-gcc is the best choice for me.

I came to use avr-gcc as I have been developing software for computers
("Unixoids") for years using gcc.

Have a nice weekend,
Falk

_____________________________
 Free pdf download: Beginning Microcontrollers with the MSP430.