I don't think change is inevitable, not perhaps in the way you are
thinking. I design hardware and write software for a living, so I am
dead set against piracy. However I believe that piracy works both ways.
I believe that my products and services are priced reasonably and
fairly, giving no incentive to pirate them, but I think that certain
industries are just plain greedy. The music and film industries,
coincidentally both led by Sony, are the worst. Sony has championed and
enforced regional codes. By any other name this is a thing of prejudice.
Why should I, in Australia, pay more for a music CD than someone who
lives in Europe, or the USA or Asia? Were I to try selling my products
at different prices to people of different nationalities I would quickly
be accused of racism, and hauled up in court, yet not only have the big
corporations gotten away with this but they have also managed to subvert
several governments, notably that of the USA into passing laws which
contravene their own legal codes. Amongst other things I refer to the
pure stupidity of the law that enables you to make copies of music or
films you bought, but not to own machinery that gets around the copy
protection that the big companies have put on them. A reasonable law
would suggest that their attempts to contravene the rights of owners
would itself be deemed illegal, but not for those with deep pockets and
powerful lobbyists. The same thing pervades the software industry, as in
regional keys for games etc.
This particualr problem becomes even more serious now that it has beeen
shown that the actual life of a CD is not the tens or hundreds of years
quoted when they were first hyped, but often less thn 2 years. recent
data from IBM shows that the metal layers corrode away, often making the
CD useless in not much more than a year. I have suffered from this
problem myself.
I honestly believe these people are too dumb for words. If somone is
going to be tempted to pirate then overpricing a product will make that
temptation much more likely, yet make a product more affordable and it
simply isn't worth the risk or expenisve of copying it. On average a DVD
costs around $35 here in Australia. that's about US$28. Far more than is
justified in my opinion, and far more expensive than they can be legally
bought in many countries, yet without a none regionally coded player you
are forced to pay whatever price they want to charge. For this reason I
very rarely purchase any CD's or DVD's, perhaps if a film is
particularly good and several family members enjoyed it I might, but
otherwise I wait until it comes on TV, then record it to DVD through the
HDTV digital decoder. I can be patient if it saves money. The film
company has lost a sale, and my guess would be that, even for good
films, the number of lost sales far outways the number of made sales. so
they might make 1 in 10 potential sales, for real, and the pirates might
make 5 or 6 more sales at a price ranging from $1 to $5 per DVD,
depending upon your haggling skills. So the company with the overheads
makes $30 profit and the guy with the quikee copee machine makes about
the same, but doesn't risk millions doing it. I'm certain the film
companies could afford to sell DVD's at far less than $5 each, sure
their profits per disc would go down, but most 'stars' aren't
worth what
they're paid anyway, and their sales volumes would more than compensate,
but I doubt they'll ever learn this.
Now the relevance here of course is that music, film and software comes
under the laws that were originally developed for books and written
music, and they have taken a similar path to music and film, price
wise, certainly here in Australia. I love a good book, and once would
read 3 or 4 books a week, At that time a 400 page paperback would
typically cost under $10, this was about 15 years ago, the same book now
might cost as much as $40, certainly far outstripping the rise in cost
of living and income for the same period. Technical books are even worse
than that, almost as if the authors want the multi-million dollar
incomes of popular writers on a fraction of the market. It is not
unusual to see fairly ordinary reference books on computers, for
instance selling at $150 and more. Now somewhere along the line someone
is making a huge amount of money, and I don't blame the authors, because
in this particular case I know that somewhere in the middle the money
disappears. There are legitimate book sellers here who discount between
30% and 50% of new releases, including all the best sellers.
Now most people couldn't justify paying $150 for a book, I buy very few
reference books unless the discounter has them or they reach end of
shelf and are sold off for $10. Now this tells me (book stores don't
sell at a loss) that the book could have sold for much less originally,
it also offers a great temptation for someone who desperately needs the
book, or one like it, but who simply can't afford it, to go and download
it for free, illegally, from the internet. This is where we get back
slightly On topic, for anyone who's stuck out my rant this far.
Microchip saw the light. They were at the arse end of the micro sales
field in the late 80's, and few engineers knew their name even. They did
something revolutionary. They designed a high quality integrated tool,
and gave it away, they then made extremely cheap development tools
available, at prices any serious hobbyist could afford. Not only that,
but they also made the design openly available so that the after market
could cater for it. I think the next 10 years were plagued by magazines
who were doing PIC programmer projects. Anyone could get into PICs
cheaply, especially students. The students of then are the engineers of
today, and guess what enough of them stayed with PIC to make Microchip
one of the biggest suppliers in the game. So their simple realisation
was that they wanted to sell microcontrollers, and to do that people
needed to be able to program and evaluate them, but while each devloper
might buy one development system, that same developer might, on average,
buy a thousand micros. It should have been obvious to all the other
vendors for years before that whjat they lost in micro sales because of
the high cost of their tools far outweighed the tiny profits they might
make on their overpriced substandard development tools. At the end of
the day a clunky DOS interface, in the era of windows, that was
anachronistic to say the least in its operation, yet which cost nearly
$1000 was not going to be trialled over a $100 kit that was slick, well
integrated and just worked (mostly!). With tools this cheap it was much
easier to sway people away from the same old micro they'd used for
years, simply because they had the tools and couldn't afford to change!
Since that era many more players have recognised that they should be
promoting their micro sales by making nit easy for people to sample and
evaluate their products. Ti, Phillips Atmel etc. Motoroila still seem
not to have learned as well as the others, and high end tools, such as
those for DSPs from Ti and AD are still grossly overpriced, but the
market is learning.
Perhaps the publishers might take a leaf out of the same book (sorry!)
and realise that they will sell more of their product, and lose less to
piracy if it were more affordable, and this applies be it music, film,
books or whatever. Lower the price and remove the incentive and
temptation to pirate. Of course I'm not the first to say this, nor will
I be the last, and I doubt that sense will ever break through their
greed clouded minds, until then I won't allow pirated software or music
in the house that I am aware of, but I don't buy much of it becuase I
refuse to be treated differently because of where I live. I also don't
buy Sony on principal.
Cheers
Al
Garlick, Colin wrote:
>Andrew,
>
>I have no connection to these links I found. And I wasn't endorsing
>copyright violation.
>I was merely pointing out by example the internet is a powerful resource
>when it comes
>to finding information. But it can also be so easily abused. I'm sure
>the music business
>knows only too well. Hiding from the truth is not going to fix anything.
>But perhaps you
>would like to express how would you like to change or police the www ?
>Clearly change is
>inevitable.
>
>Regards,
>
>Colin,
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: msp430@msp4... [mailto:msp430@msp4...] On Behalf
>Of aekalman
>Sent: 08 May 2006 19:38
>To: msp430@msp4...
>Subject: [msp430] Re: Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430 Series
>- PDF
>
>Colin.
>
>I'm not going to investigate whether the content of the links you
>provide have been made freely available by the original authors. I
>suspect that some have not. K&R, for example, is a copyrighted book -- I
>have the original on my bookshelf here. Whether it's still in print or
>is out of print does not change the copyright issues nor the rights of
>the authors and/or publishers. (disclaimer: IANAL).
>
>No one here is so naive to think that copyrights aren't violated, that
>software isn't cracked, etc. But that doesn't make it right or
legal to
>avail yourself of these things, much less publicize them.
>
>If you want help from people and organizations on this list, the least
>you can do is recognize that their livelihood comes from creating works
>for sale that are usually protected in some way.
>
>--Andrew
>
>P.S. When I have "the patience to look hard enough" I can find
plenty of
>bootleg copies of my software. That doesn't mean that it's OK to
use it
>without payment.
>
>
>--- In msp430@msp4..., "Garlick, Colin" <c-garlick2@...>
wrote:
>
>
>>Paul,
>>
>>You could also say this about these other freely available eBooks I
>>
>>
>found on the internet.
>
>
>>It's amazing what you can find out there if you've got the
patience
>>
>>
>to look hard enough.
>
>
>> The K&R bible:-
>>
>>
>http://www.cnfreeos.org/Document/the_c_prog.chm
>
>
>> A Dab-hand Guide by Mark Burgess:-
>>
>>
>http://users.ox.ac.uk/~rob/pa_pd/cpt.html
>
>
>> The C Book:-
>>
>>
>http://publications.gbdirect.co.uk/c_book/
>
>
>> C Elements of style:-
>>
>>
>http://www.oualline.com/style/index.html
>
>
>>Free Computer and IT Books:-
>>
>>
>http://www.intelligentedu.com/blogs/post/Free_Computer_Books/103/
>Free-Books-for-Unix-Linux-C-Programming-Windows-2k-Windows-Server-2003
>
>
>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Colin,
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: msp430@msp4... [mailto:msp430@msp4...] On
>>
>>
>Behalf Of Paul Curtis
>
>
>>Sent: 08 May 2006 09:40
>>To: msp430@msp4...
>>Subject: RE: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
>>
>>
>Series - PDF
>
>
>>This is the second time this has come up.
>>
>>Isn't it a violation of copyright?
>>
>>--
>>Paul Curtis, Rowley Associates Ltd http://www.rowley.co.uk
>>CrossWorks for ARM, MSP430, AVR, MAXQ, and now Cortex-M3 processors
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Resul BEDEL [mailto:badresul@...]
>>>Sent: 08 May 2006 09:34
>>>To: msp430@msp4...
>>>Subject: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
>>>
>>>
>Series -
>
>
>>>PDF
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi everybody,
>>> I have found a pdf version of Embedded Systems Design Using the TI
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>MSP430 Series (Embedded Technology) / Chris NAGY
>>> I hope it gonna be useful for all MSP430 users.
>>> Here is the download link for pdf of the book:
>>>http://rapidshare.de/files/18481644/Using_MSP430.rar.html
>>>
>>> There is also code examples inside folder.
>>>
>>>Send instant messages to your online friends
>>>http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>>>--------------------~--> Get to your groups with one click.
>>>Know instantly when new email arrives
>>>http://us.click.yahoo.com/.7bhrC/MGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
>>>--------------------------
>>>------~->
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>
>>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>>
>>
>--------------------~--> Home is just a click away. Make Yahoo! your
>home page now.
>
>
>>http://us.click.yahoo.com/DHchtC/3FxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
>>--------------------------------~-
>>
>>
>>.
>>
>>
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
>Protect your PC from spy ware with award winning anti spy technology.
>It's free.
>http://us.click.yahoo.com/97bhrC/LGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
>--------------------------------~->
>
>.
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>.
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Andrew,
I have no connection to these links I found. And I wasn't endorsing
copyright violation.
I was merely pointing out by example the internet is a powerful resource
when it comes
to finding information. But it can also be so easily abused. I'm sure
the music business
knows only too well. Hiding from the truth is not going to fix anything.
But perhaps you
would like to express how would you like to change or police the www ?
Clearly change is
inevitable.
Regards,
Colin,
-----Original Message-----
From: msp430@msp4... [mailto:msp430@msp4...] On Behalf
Of aekalman
Sent: 08 May 2006 19:38
To: msp430@msp4...
Subject: [msp430] Re: Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430 Series
- PDF
Colin.
I'm not going to investigate whether the content of the links you
provide have been made freely available by the original authors. I
suspect that some have not. K&R, for example, is a copyrighted book -- I
have the original on my bookshelf here. Whether it's still in print or
is out of print does not change the copyright issues nor the rights of
the authors and/or publishers. (disclaimer: IANAL).
No one here is so naive to think that copyrights aren't violated, that
software isn't cracked, etc. But that doesn't make it right or legal
to
avail yourself of these things, much less publicize them.
If you want help from people and organizations on this list, the least
you can do is recognize that their livelihood comes from creating works
for sale that are usually protected in some way.
--Andrew
P.S. When I have "the patience to look hard enough" I can find plenty
of
bootleg copies of my software. That doesn't mean that it's OK to use
it
without payment.
--- In msp430@msp4..., "Garlick, Colin" <c-garlick2@...> wrote:
>
>
> Paul,
>
> You could also say this about these other freely available eBooks I
found on the internet.
> It's amazing what you can find out there if
you've got the patience
to look hard enough.
>
> The K&R bible:-
http://www.cnfreeos.org/Document/the_c_prog.chm
> A Dab-hand Guide by Mark Burgess:-
http://users.ox.ac.uk/~rob/pa_pd/cpt.html
> The C Book:-
http://publications.gbdirect.co.uk/c_book/
> C Elements of style:-
http://www.oualline.com/style/index.html
>
> Free Computer and IT Books:-
http://www.intelligentedu.com/blogs/post/Free_Computer_Books/103/
Free-Books-for-Unix-Linux-C-Programming-Windows-2k-Windows-Server-2003
>
> Regards,
>
> Colin,
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: msp430@msp4... [mailto:msp430@msp4...] On
Behalf Of Paul Curtis
> Sent: 08 May 2006 09:40
> To: msp430@msp4...
> Subject: RE: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
Series - PDF
>
> This is the second time this has come up.
>
> Isn't it a violation of copyright?
>
> --
> Paul Curtis, Rowley Associates Ltd http://www.rowley.co.uk
> CrossWorks for ARM, MSP430, AVR, MAXQ, and now Cortex-M3 processors
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Resul BEDEL [mailto:badresul@...]
> > Sent: 08 May 2006 09:34
> > To: msp430@msp4...
> > Subject: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
Series -
> > PDF
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi everybody,
> > I have found a pdf version of Embedded Systems Design Using the TI
> > MSP430 Series (Embedded Technology) / Chris
NAGY
> > I hope it gonna be useful for all MSP430 users.
> > Here is the download link for pdf of the book:
> > http://rapidshare.de/files/18481644/Using_MSP430.rar.html
> >
> > There is also code examples inside folder.
> >
> > Send instant messages to your online friends
> > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > --------------------~--> Get to your groups with one click.
> > Know instantly when new email arrives
> > http://us.click.yahoo.com/.7bhrC/MGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
> > --------------------------
> > ------~->
> >
> > .
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
--------------------~--> Home is just a click away. Make Yahoo! your
home page now.
>
http://us.click.yahoo.com/DHchtC/3FxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
> --------------------------------~-
> >
>
> .
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
Protect your PC from spy ware with award winning anti spy technology.
It's free.
http://us.click.yahoo.com/97bhrC/LGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------~->
.
Yahoo! Groups Links
Reply by aekalman●May 8, 20062006-05-08
Colin.
I'm not going to investigate whether the content of the links you
provide have been made freely available by the original authors. I
suspect that some have not. K&R, for example, is a copyrighted book --
I have the original on my bookshelf here. Whether it's still in print
or is out of print does not change the copyright issues nor the rights
of the authors and/or publishers. (disclaimer: IANAL).
No one here is so naive to think that copyrights aren't violated, that
software isn't cracked, etc. But that doesn't make it right or legal
to avail yourself of these things, much less publicize them.
If you want help from people and organizations on this list, the least
you can do is recognize that their livelihood comes from creating
works for sale that are usually protected in some way.
--Andrew
P.S. When I have "the patience to look hard enough" I can find plenty
of bootleg copies of my software. That doesn't mean that it's OK to
use it without payment.
--- In msp430@msp4..., "Garlick, Colin" <c-garlick2@...> wrote:
>
>
> Paul,
>
> You could also say this about these other freely available eBooks I
found on the internet.
> It's amazing what you can find out there if
you've got the patience
to look hard enough.
>
> The K&R bible:-
http://www.cnfreeos.org/Document/the_c_prog.chm
> A Dab-hand Guide by Mark Burgess:-
http://users.ox.ac.uk/~rob/pa_pd/cpt.html
> The C Book:-
http://publications.gbdirect.co.uk/c_book/
> C Elements of style:-
http://www.oualline.com/style/index.html
>
> Free Computer and IT Books:-
http://www.intelligentedu.com/blogs/post/Free_Computer_Books/103/
Free-Books-for-Unix-Linux-C-Programming-Windows-2k-Windows-Server-2003
>
> Regards,
>
> Colin,
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: msp430@msp4... [mailto:msp430@msp4...] On
Behalf Of Paul Curtis
> Sent: 08 May 2006 09:40
> To: msp430@msp4...
> Subject: RE: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
Series - PDF
>
> This is the second time this has come up.
>
> Isn't it a violation of copyright?
>
> --
> Paul Curtis, Rowley Associates Ltd http://www.rowley.co.uk
> CrossWorks for ARM, MSP430, AVR, MAXQ, and now Cortex-M3 processors
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Resul BEDEL [mailto:badresul@...]
> > Sent: 08 May 2006 09:34
> > To: msp430@msp4...
> > Subject: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
Series -
> > PDF
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi everybody,
> > I have found a pdf version of Embedded Systems Design Using the TI
> > MSP430 Series (Embedded Technology) / Chris NAGY
> > I hope it gonna be useful for all MSP430 users.
> > Here is the download link for pdf of the book:
> > http://rapidshare.de/files/18481644/Using_MSP430.rar.html
> >
> > There is also code examples inside folder.
> >
> > Send instant messages to your online friends
> > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > --------------------~--> Get to your groups with one click.
> > Know instantly when new email arrives
> > http://us.click.yahoo.com/.7bhrC/MGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
> > --------------------------
> > ------~->
> >
> > .
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
--------------------~--> Home is just a click away. Make Yahoo! your
home page now.
>
http://us.click.yahoo.com/DHchtC/3FxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
> --------------------------------~->
>
> .
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
Reply by Garlick, Colin●May 8, 20062006-05-08
Paul,
You could also say this about these other freely available eBooks I found on the
internet.
It's amazing what you can find out there if you've got the patience to
look hard enough.
The K&R bible:-
http://www.cnfreeos.org/Document/the_c_prog.chm
A Dab-hand Guide by Mark Burgess:- http://users.ox.ac.uk/~rob/pa_pd/cpt.html
The C Book:- http://publications.gbdirect.co.uk/c_book/
C Elements of style:- http://www.oualline.com/style/index.html
Free Computer and IT Books:-
http://www.intelligentedu.com/blogs/post/Free_Computer_Books/103/Free-Books-for-Unix-Linux-C-Programming-Windows-2k-Windows-Server-2003
Regards,
Colin,
-----Original Message-----
From: msp430@msp4... [mailto:msp430@msp4...] On Behalf Of Paul Curtis
Sent: 08 May 2006 09:40
To: msp430@msp4...
Subject: RE: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430 Series - PDF
This is the second time this has come up.
Isn't it a violation of copyright?
--
Paul Curtis, Rowley Associates Ltd http://www.rowley.co.uk
CrossWorks for ARM, MSP430, AVR, MAXQ, and now Cortex-M3 processors
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Resul BEDEL [mailto:badresul@badr...]
> Sent: 08 May 2006 09:34
> To: msp430@msp4...
> Subject: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430 Series -
> PDF
>
>
>
> Hi everybody,
> I have found a pdf version of Embedded Systems Design Using the TI
> MSP430 Series (Embedded Technology) / Chris NAGY
> I hope it gonna be useful for all MSP430 users.
> Here is the download link for pdf of the book:
> http://rapidshare.de/files/18481644/Using_MSP430.rar.html
>
> There is also code examples inside folder.
>
> Send instant messages to your online friends
> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~--> Get to your groups with one click.
> Know instantly when new email arrives
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/.7bhrC/MGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
> --------------------------
> ------~->
>
> .
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Home
is just a click away. Make Yahoo! your home page now.
http://us.click.yahoo.com/DHchtC/3FxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------~->
.
Yahoo! Groups Links
Reply by Paul Curtis●May 8, 20062006-05-08
This is the second time this has come up.
Isn't it a violation of copyright?
--
Paul Curtis, Rowley Associates Ltd http://www.rowley.co.uk
CrossWorks for ARM, MSP430, AVR, MAXQ, and now Cortex-M3 processors
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Resul BEDEL [mailto:badresul@badr...]
> Sent: 08 May 2006 09:34
> To: msp430@msp4...
> Subject: [msp430] Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
> Series - PDF
>
>
>
> Hi everybody,
> I have found a pdf version of Embedded Systems Design Using
> the TI MSP430 Series (Embedded Technology) / Chris NAGY
> I hope it gonna be useful for all MSP430 users.
> Here is the download link for pdf of the book:
> http://rapidshare.de/files/18481644/Using_MSP430.rar.html
>
> There is also code examples inside folder.
>
> Send instant messages to your online friends
> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~--> Get to your groups with one click.
> Know instantly when new email arrives
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/.7bhrC/MGxNAA/yQLSAA/CFFolB/TM
> --------------------------
> ------~->
>
> .
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Reply by Resul BEDEL●May 8, 20062006-05-08
Hi everybody,
I have found a pdf version of Embedded Systems Design Using the TI MSP430
Series (Embedded Technology) / Chris NAGY
I hope it gonna be useful for all MSP430 users.
Here is the download link for pdf of the book:
http://rapidshare.de/files/18481644/Using_MSP430.rar.html
There is also code examples inside folder.
Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
