scott.manton@gmail.com wrote:
> It's correct that I need hi-speed USB for the application, not for
> FPGA configuration.  I didn't realize that it would be a lot easier to
> configure the FPGA directly from the FX2LP.  But I still expect that
> it will take longer to configure on power-up than if the XCF08P were
>  used. Is that actually the case?
>
> Our device will not be mass produced so keeping the development time
> down is important.  It sounds like SPI SerialFLASH is a simple and
> standard solution for local storage.  More of an unknown for me is
> configuration of the FPGA.  Ulf mentioned using the  Synchronous
> Serial Port for configuration interface (DIN, CCLK), is this an
> option for the FX2LP?  Is it a lot of work?

The AT89C51SND3 can use its SPI at 12 Mbps to configure the FPGA.
An ARM can configure at higher speed.

-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
ulf@a-t-m-e-l.com
This message is intended to be my own personal view and it
may or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB

It's correct that I need hi-speed USB for the application, not for FPGA
configuration.  I didn't realize that it would be a lot easier to
configure the FPGA directly from the FX2LP.  But I still expect that it
will take longer to configure on power-up than if the XCF08P were used.
 Is that actually the case?

Our device will not be mass produced so keeping the development time
down is important.  It sounds like SPI SerialFLASH is a simple and
standard solution for local storage.  More of an unknown for me is
configuration of the FPGA.  Ulf mentioned using the  Synchronous Serial
Port for configuration interface (DIN, CCLK), is this an option for the
FX2LP?  Is it a lot of work?

Ulf Samuelsson wrote:
> Jim Granville wrote:
> 
>>Ulf Samuelsson wrote:
>>
>>>>then the OPs best solution is probably to ditch the XCF08, and use
>>>>any of a wide range of more standard devices, like Ulf's DataFlash
>>>>( Atmel offer two types ), or Std SPI SerialFLASH.
>>>
>>>
>>>What so std about it?
>>
>>about what ?
>>
> 
> 
> "Std SPI SerialFLASH"

  ==> made by many companies ==> Multi sourced, and cheap.
SPI SerialFLASH comes from Winbond, SSTi, Atmel (AT26xx),
all with similar (std) opcodes to Read, and similar (std) 8 Pin pinouts.

Atmel AT26xx data also states:
JEDEC Standard Manufacturer and Device ID Read Methodology

Common now is Read,[03H] and FastRead,[0BH] which adds a dummy byte to 
allow the chip to get ready, for faster shifting.
Most devices will warp around.

-jg

Jim Granville wrote:
> Ulf Samuelsson wrote:
>>> then the OPs best solution is probably to ditch the XCF08, and use
>>> any of a wide range of more standard devices, like Ulf's DataFlash
>>> ( Atmel offer two types ), or Std SPI SerialFLASH.
>>
>>
>> What so std about it?
>
> about what ?
>

"Std SPI SerialFLASH"

-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
ulf@a-t-m-e-l.com
This message is intended to be my own personal view and it
may or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB

Ulf Samuelsson wrote:
>>then the OPs best solution is probably to ditch the XCF08, and use any
>>of a wide range of more standard devices, like Ulf's DataFlash
>>( Atmel offer two types ), or Std SPI SerialFLASH.
> 
> 
> What so std about it?

about what ?

> 
>>The FX2LP can easily handle the SPI-FPGA
>>
> 
> Don't know what the FX2LP cost but the AT89C51SND3 has high speed USB
> and will allow low cost flash storage through NAND flash.

Did you mean AT85C51SND3 ?  I don't think AT89C51SND3 exists ?
The AT85 is ram cored, like the FX2LP.

That could be a very nice device for FPGA-USB(high speed),
tho probably not as fast a the FX2LP ?
AT85C51SND3 claims 6MBytes ( 48 MBd )  on the PSI ?

-jg

>
> then the OPs best solution is probably to ditch the XCF08, and use any
> of a wide range of more standard devices, like Ulf's DataFlash
> ( Atmel offer two types ), or Std SPI SerialFLASH.

What so std about it?

> The FX2LP can easily handle the SPI-FPGA
>
Don't know what the FX2LP cost but the AT89C51SND3 has high speed USB
and will allow low cost flash storage through NAND flash.

> -jg

-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
ulf@a-t-m-e-l.com
This message is intended to be my own personal view and it
may or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB

Ulf Samuelsson wrote:

> scott.manton@gmail.com wrote:
> 
>>First off I am new to JTAG emulation.   I am required to program a
>>Xilinx configuration PROM from a microcontroller.  I realize that I
>>can program the PROM with a cable from the parallel port but the
>>product will require field upgrades.  I've been sifting through docs
>>from Xilinx and searching the web, and it seems like this should be
>>easy and straight forward to implement.  What I have learned so far
>>in my reading is that JTAG has a lot more capability than what I
>>actually need, which is just the instruction sequence for
>>programming.   Can anyone point me to some reference material that is
>>geared toward someone new to JTAG emulation?  If there were a
>>document that spelled out just what I need, and possibly some coding
>>examples it would be very much appreciated.
>>
>>The relevant project details are as follows:  FPGA  is Xilinx Virtex-4
>>LX part # XCV4LX25, and the PROM which I need to program for FPGA
>>configuration is XCF08P.  Microcontoller is the 8051-based Cypress
>>FX2LP Hi-speed USB controller.
>>
> 
> 
> I would be very interested in knowing why you need to have high speed USB.
> The XCF08P is 8 Mbit, so with raw USB transfer on a full speed USB host,
> you will be limited to configuration times of 1 second.
> It is very likely that the flash programming time of the device is the real
> limit to the programing time of the configurator.

  Commonly, when one sees a FX2LP _and_ a FPGA, the high speed is not 
there for config program, but is needed for the final application data
pathways.

  Since Xilinx insist on this 'unique' sales model :
- Here is our great FLASH Config Device
- No, we can't tell you how to program it

then the OPs best solution is probably to ditch the XCF08, and use any
of a wide range of more standard devices, like Ulf's DataFlash
( Atmel offer two types ), or Std SPI SerialFLASH.
The FX2LP can easily handle the SPI-FPGA

-jg

scott.manton@gmail.com wrote:
> First off I am new to JTAG emulation.   I am required to program a
> Xilinx configuration PROM from a microcontroller.  I realize that I
> can program the PROM with a cable from the parallel port but the
> product will require field upgrades.  I've been sifting through docs
> from Xilinx and searching the web, and it seems like this should be
> easy and straight forward to implement.  What I have learned so far
> in my reading is that JTAG has a lot more capability than what I
> actually need, which is just the instruction sequence for
> programming.   Can anyone point me to some reference material that is
> geared toward someone new to JTAG emulation?  If there were a
> document that spelled out just what I need, and possibly some coding
> examples it would be very much appreciated.
>
> The relevant project details are as follows:  FPGA  is Xilinx Virtex-4
> LX part # XCV4LX25, and the PROM which I need to program for FPGA
> configuration is XCF08P.  Microcontoller is the 8051-based Cypress
> FX2LP Hi-speed USB controller.
>

I would be very interested in knowing why you need to have high speed USB.
The XCF08P is 8 Mbit, so with raw USB transfer on a full speed USB host,
you will be limited to configuration times of 1 second.
It is very likely that the flash programming time of the device is the real
limit to
the programing time of the configurator.

If this is the case, and you thus can accept full speed USB, then what you
want is a micro where you can connect low cost flash and configure
the it using a high speed interface.

The Atmel part that would do this is the AT91SAM7S64 (and soon the
AT91SAM7S321).
The key functions ont his part are:
USB Device to download the configuration data
Synchronous Serial Port for configuration interface (DIN, CCLK)
SPI port to access a serial dataflash (AT45DBxxx)

The AT91SAM7S64 will, when USB is used, run at 48 MHz providing a
configuration speed of 12 MHz using the built in SSC.
(The SSC speed will increase to 24 Mhz on future devices)
The SPI can run at 24 Mhz accessing the dataflash.

Both the SPI and the SSC is supported by a double buffered DMA capable of
handling 64 kB blocks.
The SAM7S64 only has 16 kB of SRAM so you would probably double buffer 4 kB
blocks.
The PDC will reduce interrupts to about once every 2,7 ms per (SPI/SSC)
channel -- Really low.
Even when the configuration speed goes up to 24 Mhz, interrupts are still
around 1300 per second,
allowing the CPU to mostly idle.

The AT45DBxxx dataflash are available in configurations between 1 Mbit to 64
Mbit.
They are typically A LOT cheaper than configurators.

Atmel has USB Mass Storage Device S/W running on the AT91SAM7S64
(Check www.at91.com) and I think this supports the dataflash by now.

The only think you really need to do is to write the stuff to do the
configuration using the SSC.
Think this would be a nice appnote.

> Scott

If you really want to use a configurator then you can also use the AT17F
series
http://www.atmel.com/dyn/products/datasheets.asp?family_id=625
Using a large part will allow you to store several configurations.

The Programming Specification is here:
http://www.atmel.com/dyn/resources/prod_documents/doc3018.pdf
The interface is more or less I2C (again limiting the usability of High
Speed USB)

-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
ulf@a-t-m-e-l.com
This message is intended to be my own personal view and it
may or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB