>I have been out of the design game for 5 odd years now. I would like
>to do a few projects, but its not worth it if I have to spend
>thousands on c compilers. I am too lazy to do assembler these days
>(thats what PC programming does to you!) so asm is out. Looking for
>small devices from atmel and zilog and the like. The last toughest
>requirement is I use windows, so no linux. Any suggestions?
You are just as my expereince
I kept some 8051-alikes from fault VHS and 9600 baud modems
With SDCC http://sdcc.sourceforge.net compiler and Code Blocks
http://www.codeblocks.org/ IDE i worked very well
The 1st program was(after PCB cleaning from useless components)an LCD
tester,a modified http://freewebs.com/80x51/source/LCD/lcd.h version for
port1 taken in http://mcu-programming.blogspot.com/search/label/LCD and I
soon restarted programming
Main problem at beginning was intervacing my Willeprom to Kubuntu,but it's
all done! :-)
All for free,funny and brainstorming...
Now my main supply is flea market :-D
Reply by ●December 6, 20072007-12-06
Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com> writes:
> > http://www.redhat.com/services/custom/gnupro/
>
> Are the versions shipped really as ancient as those listed on
> the page (gcc 2.95.3, gdb 4.0)? Or does the "and above" mean
> that later versions are also being shipped. [I think most
> people would be more interested to know the most recent version
> supported rather than the oldest version supported.]
After talking with the powers that be, I decided to rewrite the
confusing sections myself, and they agreed to use my changes.
Hopefully it's more obvious what we do, without miscommunicating
anything.
Thanks for the feedback!
DJ
Reply by Andre Gompel (firmware consultant)●November 29, 20072007-11-29
I have used the gnuarm gcc compiler, for the ARM7 TDMI based Analog
Device chip ADuC7026 and ADuC7028.
I have used version 2.98 and 4.1, and both are excellent products really
solid. The 4.1 version generates more compact code (about 30 % less in
size). I have never run benchmarks, but often smaaller code is also faster.
I am delighted with the quality, reliability of the
compiler/linker/assembler, which in my view is superior to many
"commercial" compilers.
Even the documentation is better that many other compilers.
The assembly/C programinng API is quite good too.
The fact that the compiler is free open source does not spoil the pot!
Andre Gompel (O3SYS, Fremont, California)
Robert Adsett wrote:
> On Nov 28, 3:31 am, The Real Andy <thereala...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 06:23:05 -0800 (PST), Robert Adsett
>>
>> <s...@aeolusdevelopment.com> wrote:
>>> On Nov 26, 4:28 am, The Real Andy <thereala...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>> Cheers Al. Will take a look at the Atmel parts. The zilog stuff looks
>>>> like it has potential as well. In fact, I spotted a zilog part that
>>>> might fit the bill perfectly. I want to do some 12V Batt
>>>> charging/management for the boat and 4wd and I figure that I can roll
>>>> it all into a single package. Might have a poke around the Atmel site
>>>> and see what parts they have.
>>> If that's what you are looking to do, you might want to take a look at
>>> Analog Devices. They have an ARM part designed to fit that role.
>> Thanks Robert. CAn you give me a bit more of a tip, perhaps a part
>> number or series.?
>
> Analog doesn't exactly tout their microprocessors in an obvious
> fashion on the front page of their site. They are not included in the
> embedded processing section but rather under Analog microcontrollers.
> Take a look at
>
> ADUC7033
> ADUC7032-8L
>
>
> They have 12V and 200mV A/D inputs (battery Voltage and current shunt
> inputs). And since they are ARM parts GCC and eval commercial
> packages should both work.
>
> I don't know how readily available they are, but I do have a project
> in mind that might make use so a may check up in a while a find out
> (it's still a project that's on the horizon rather than active
> though).
>
> Robert
Reply by Robert Adsett●November 28, 20072007-11-28
On Nov 28, 3:31 am, The Real Andy <thereala...@nospam.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 06:23:05 -0800 (PST), Robert Adsett
>
> <s...@aeolusdevelopment.com> wrote:
> >On Nov 26, 4:28 am, The Real Andy <thereala...@nospam.com> wrote:
> >> Cheers Al. Will take a look at the Atmel parts. The zilog stuff looks
> >> like it has potential as well. In fact, I spotted a zilog part that
> >> might fit the bill perfectly. I want to do some 12V Batt
> >> charging/management for the boat and 4wd and I figure that I can roll
> >> it all into a single package. Might have a poke around the Atmel site
> >> and see what parts they have.
>
> >If that's what you are looking to do, you might want to take a look at
> >Analog Devices. They have an ARM part designed to fit that role.
>
> Thanks Robert. CAn you give me a bit more of a tip, perhaps a part
> number or series.?
Analog doesn't exactly tout their microprocessors in an obvious
fashion on the front page of their site. They are not included in the
embedded processing section but rather under Analog microcontrollers.
Take a look at
ADUC7033
ADUC7032-8L
They have 12V and 200mV A/D inputs (battery Voltage and current shunt
inputs). And since they are ARM parts GCC and eval commercial
packages should both work.
I don't know how readily available they are, but I do have a project
in mind that might make use so a may check up in a while a find out
(it's still a project that's on the horizon rather than active
though).
Robert
Reply by John Devereux●November 28, 20072007-11-28
The Real Andy <therealandy@nospam.com> writes:
> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 06:23:05 -0800 (PST), Robert Adsett
> <sub2@aeolusdevelopment.com> wrote:
>
>>On Nov 26, 4:28 am, The Real Andy <thereala...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> Cheers Al. Will take a look at the Atmel parts. The zilog stuff looks
>>> like it has potential as well. In fact, I spotted a zilog part that
>>> might fit the bill perfectly. I want to do some 12V Batt
>>> charging/management for the boat and 4wd and I figure that I can roll
>>> it all into a single package. Might have a poke around the Atmel site
>>> and see what parts they have.
>>
>>If that's what you are looking to do, you might want to take a look at
>>Analog Devices. They have an ARM part designed to fit that role.
>>
>>Robert
>
> Thanks Robert. CAn you give me a bit more of a tip, perhaps a part
> number or series.?
Reply by The Real Andy●November 28, 20072007-11-28
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 06:23:05 -0800 (PST), Robert Adsett
<sub2@aeolusdevelopment.com> wrote:
>On Nov 26, 4:28 am, The Real Andy <thereala...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> Cheers Al. Will take a look at the Atmel parts. The zilog stuff looks
>> like it has potential as well. In fact, I spotted a zilog part that
>> might fit the bill perfectly. I want to do some 12V Batt
>> charging/management for the boat and 4wd and I figure that I can roll
>> it all into a single package. Might have a poke around the Atmel site
>> and see what parts they have.
>
>If that's what you are looking to do, you might want to take a look at
>Analog Devices. They have an ARM part designed to fit that role.
>
>Robert
Thanks Robert. CAn you give me a bit more of a tip, perhaps a part
number or series.?
Reply by Grant Edwards●November 26, 20072007-11-26
On 2007-11-26, DJ Delorie <dj@delorie.com> wrote:
>> I assumed that support was probably weighted towards architectures
>> capable of running embedded Linux.
>
> Or manufacturers who offer such chips; the m32c family can't
> run Linux but Renesas's SH family can.
>
>> Are you guys what's left of Cygnus after the eCos guys in
>> England got cut loose?
>
> Half of us are Cygnoids, yes. The other half are leftovers
> from the Wirespeed acquisition. Most of the Cygnoids now
> support those same tools but for native Linux, in another
> group in the company.
>
>> The AVR support isn't too bad, but it is a purely 8-bit part and
>> that really hurts things like pointer manipulation.
>
> It gets worse when you have 24 bit pointers, like the m32c.
How's the m16c support for the various memory models? 4-5
years ago I was trying to figure out how hard it would be to do
an m16c port that supported the memory model with 64K of data
space and >64K of code space. It looked pretty difficult to do
it efficiently (without using long pointers for everything).
AFAICT, gcc really didn't like pointers that varied in size and
I wanted to avoid long data pointers. It all turned out to be
moot because I ended up using the H8300 with all 32-bit
pointers anyway.
>> I tried to get gEDA and PCB going about a year ago, but the
>> peices weren't going together very smoothly for me. I broke
>> down and used Eagle.
>
> We've come a long way recently, although our Windows support
> is still weak
That wouldn't have bothered me. :)
> and the PCB documentation is sorely in need of a rewrite, a
> project I just started this week.
>
> As for Eagle, many of my boards would have exceeded it's free
> version's limitations anyway.
I've only done one small board with it and it was well within
the bounds for the free version.
--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! With YOU, I can be
at MYSELF ... We don't NEED
visi.com Dan Rather ...
Reply by ●November 26, 20072007-11-26
Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com> writes:
> I assumed that support was probably weighted towards architectures
> capable of running embedded Linux.
Or manufacturers who offer such chips; the m32c family can't run Linux
but Renesas's SH family can.
> Are you guys what's left of Cygnus after the eCos guys in England
> got cut loose?
Half of us are Cygnoids, yes. The other half are leftovers from the
Wirespeed acquisition. Most of the Cygnoids now support those same
tools but for native Linux, in another group in the company.
> The AVR support isn't too bad, but it is a purely 8-bit part and
> that really hurts things like pointer manipulation.
It gets worse when you have 24 bit pointers, like the m32c.
> I tried to get gEDA and PCB going about a year ago, but the peices
> weren't going together very smoothly for me. I broke down and used
> Eagle.
We've come a long way recently, although our Windows support is still
weak and the PCB documentation is sorely in need of a rewrite, a
project I just started this week.
As for Eagle, many of my boards would have exceeded it's free
version's limitations anyway.
Reply by Grant Edwards●November 26, 20072007-11-26
On 2007-11-26, DJ Delorie <dj@delorie.com> wrote:
>> No support for the smaller chips (6812, AVR, MSP430) that a
>> tinkerer like the OP would be using?
>
> If you wanted to buy enough support seats, we'll sell support for
> pretty much anything ;-)
I assumed that support was probably weighted towards
architectures capable of running embedded Linux. Are you guys
what's left of Cygnus after the eCos guys in England got cut
loose?
> Keep in mind that gcc doesn't "like" small parts, esp 8-bit mcus. I
> had a hard time getting it to produce good code on the m32c family,
> which has a mix of register sizes.
It does a pretty good job with 16-bit parts like the 6812 and
MSP430 (I sure which '430 support would get merged into the
official gcc sources). The AVR support isn't too bad, but it
is a purely 8-bit part and that really hurts things like
pointer manipulation.
>> Nice little project. What did you use to layout the PCB?
>
> gEDA and PCB :-) http://pcb.sourceforge.net/
>
> (I'm one of the PCB developers)
I tried to get gEDA and PCB going about a year ago, but the
peices weren't going together very smoothly for me. I broke
down and used Eagle.
>> I haven't seen smoothly curved traces like that since the days
>> of bishop graphics tape and hand-cut rubylith film.
>
> Data General used to have software that did that also, which
> gave me the idea. It's a recent option in pcb called the
> "global puller" I've been working on, although on more complex
> boards it still sometimes goes nuts with the traces. The
> result is always a work of art, it's just that sometimes the
> artist is a two year old with a crayon.
>
> I'm not sure it's worth the effort, but it does make pcb's
> board unique.
Yup, they certainly caught my eye.
--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! I'm meditating on
at the FORMALDEHYDE and the
visi.com ASBESTOS leaking into my
PERSONAL SPACE!!
Reply by ●November 26, 20072007-11-26
Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com> writes:
> No support for the smaller chips (6812, AVR, MSP430) that a
> tinkerer like the OP would be using?
If you wanted to buy enough support seats, we'll sell support for
pretty much anything ;-)
Keep in mind that gcc doesn't "like" small parts, esp 8-bit mcus. I
had a hard time getting it to produce good code on the m32c family,
which has a mix of register sizes.
> Are the versions shipped really as ancient as those listed on
> the page (gcc 2.95.3, gdb 4.0)?
No, the page is just out of date. We push to have the new chips
added, though. We're currently shipping gcc 4.2.x and gdb 6.5.
> I haven't seen smoothly curved traces like that since the days of
> bishop graphics tape and hand-cut rubylith film.
Data General used to have software that did that also, which gave me
the idea. It's a recent option in pcb called the "global puller" I've
been working on, although on more complex boards it still sometimes
goes nuts with the traces. The result is always a work of art, it's
just that sometimes the artist is a two year old with a crayon.
I'm not sure it's worth the effort, but it does make pcb's board
unique.