On 27 =AAubat, 18:45, Albert van der Horst <alb...@spenarnc.xs4all.nl>
wrote:
> In article <20837b2e-d96a-4da3-8cf2-18f629a1b...@b29g2000hsa.googlegroups.=
com>,
>
> icegray =A0<iceg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Hi,
> >I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
> >details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces,
> >audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded linux,
> >maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
> >I have been using Renesas M16C series as 16 bit Microcontroller and I
> >need a powerfull 32bit CPU. I don't think use SuperH series because
> >ARM9 has a lot of documets and sources i think. Freescale MX9328MX21S
> >and Atmel SAM9263 or SAM9261 can better choices ? Could you please
> >share your experiences about this subject?
>
> If your experience is with Renesas why not move up to M32C?
>
> >Thanks in advance
>
> --
> --
> Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
> Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
> albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=3Dnhttp://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst
There are more ARM users so more document and more support. Also ARM
is better than M32C to future.
Reply by Albert van der Horst●February 27, 20082008-02-27
In article <20837b2e-d96a-4da3-8cf2-18f629a1b33d@b29g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>,
icegray <icegray@gmail.com> wrote:
>Hi,
>I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
>details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces,
>audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded linux,
>maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
>I have been using Renesas M16C series as 16 bit Microcontroller and I
>need a powerfull 32bit CPU. I don't think use SuperH series because
>ARM9 has a lot of documets and sources i think. Freescale MX9328MX21S
>and Atmel SAM9263 or SAM9261 can better choices ? Could you please
>share your experiences about this subject?
If your experience is with Renesas why not move up to M32C?
>Thanks in advance
--
--
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst
Reply by Ulf Samuelsson●February 26, 20082008-02-26
"icegray" <icegray@gmail.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:0692a387-d978-4a82-b8b1-4ef278d1b667@28g2000hsw.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 25, 9:48 pm, "Ulf Samuelsson" <u...@a-t-m-e-l.com> wrote:
> "icegray" <iceg...@gmail.com> skrev i
> meddelandetnews:20837b2e-d96a-4da3-8cf2-18f629a1b33d@b29g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Hi,
> > I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
> > details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces,
> > audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded linux,
> > maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
> > I have been using Renesas M16C series as 16 bit Microcontroller and I
> > need a powerfull 32bit CPU. I don't think use SuperH series because
> > ARM9 has a lot of documets and sources i think. Freescale MX9328MX21S
> > and Atmel SAM9263 or SAM9261 can better choices ? Could you please
> > share your experiences about this subject?
> > Thanks in advance
>
> The AT91SAM9263 has some interesting features for this.
> 1) Dual bus.
> Refreshing 800 x 600 x 60 Hz * 16 bpp = 56,25 MB /second
> If you use a 40 MHz PSRAM you get 80 MB/second (max)
> so you use 70% of the bandwidth for refresh.
> The 800 x 600 is just on the border of what you can do on this bus.
> You can move over to 100 MHz SDRAM and the loading
> goes down , but you lose the Ethernet controller due to pin muxing.
>
> A good driver will draw the screen in the double buffered memory
> on the primary bus 100 Mhz 32 bit bus,
> and will let the DMA controller copy the buffer to a dual buffer on
> the secondary 16 bit bus.
>
> With a static picture, the display refresh will cause zero overhead on
> the primary bus
>
what is the main advantages of Dual External Bus Interface at
AT91SAM9263? Can i connect and configure to different RAMs like as
embedded computing RAM and video RAM? if yes, can i do it with linux?
==> Yes, EBI0 is the primary bus, typically 32 bit SDRAM.
EBI1 is the secondary bus, typically 16 bit PSRAM
When the LCD is doing display refresh, it reads the display data
from EBI1. For a static display, once the images is available
in the PSRAM, the display refresh will cause zero overhead on EBI1.
It should be possible to use with Linux, but still needs work
on the driver level. I know a consultant which started
working on such a driver some weeks ago.
--
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
This is intended to be my personal opinion which may,
or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB
Reply by Joerg●February 26, 20082008-02-26
Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>
>
> icegray wrote:
>>
>>> Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project.
>>>>>>>>> Project
>>>>>>>>> details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user
>>>>>>>>> interfaces,
>>>>>>>>> audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded
>>>>>>>>> linux,
>>>>>>>>> maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
>>>
>>>>>>>> You need a Pentium class industrial PC with WinCE or Embedded XP.
>>>
>> What is the better sides of windows? Why windows is best choice?
>
> Because CE simply works, and it is well supported and documented (as
> opposed to linux incomprehensibility); finding all sorts of components
> and drivers would not be a problem; most of it is plug and play type of
> stuff (as opposed to do-it-yourself linux incompleteness); hiring the
> sensible developers and mediocre supporters (as opposed to the
> hysterical zealots of linux) would be a lot easier also.
>
> BTW, I am involved in the design of the vehicle entertainment systems.
> Being the OEM developer, you are liable for your software and hardware,
> and you are required to use only the approved software and hardware
> components, and there is a number of tests that your system have to
> pass. The project that you are talking about weights several hundred
> thousand lines in C++, this is a pretty serious endeavour so the amateur
> approach is not feasible.
>
Ok, it has been many years ago but we studied this matter quite
intensely. We ended up not being convinced at all regarding WinCE. From
MS we mostly got answers like "this partner" or "that partner" would
have the answer. So we went with QNX, where all our questions were
exhaustively answered by the local sales guy, he didn't even have to
contact the factory much. Now that is a reliable OS.
This was for a medical ultrasound scanner BTW. Flat screen, networkable,
the works.
--
Regards, Joerg
http://www.analogconsultants.com/
Reply by dalai lamah●February 26, 20082008-02-26
Un bel giorno badal_akr digit�:
> I have never worked on the embedded linux.
Lucky you!
> And even i am not aware of any phone available in the market on embedded
> linux. Can any body provide this information so that i can have a look on
> this.
There are plenty:
http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT9423084269.html
If you want more, google for "linux phone". You will find also some open
projects like OpenMoko, exciting but not ready for the mass market (and
probably they'll never be, but still...).
--
emboliaschizoide.splinder.com
Reply by John Speth●February 26, 20082008-02-26
>>> I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
>>
>>Check TI OMAP and TI DaVinci Processors.
>>They are excellent.
>>
> You can check with the Xscale PXA270xxx or ST nomadik chips they are
> superb and good processing power.
My big chance to take a shot at Intel/Marvell regarding Xscale:
Stay away from anything Xscale or Marvell or Intel. Engineering support is
pathetic to non-existent from both Intel and Marvell. The PXA270 is EOL.
Nobody at Marvell is able to help and even willing to lift a finger to help.
The Intel web site sucks if you need to find information. Marvell's web
site is a joke last time I looked.
JJS
Reply by icegray●February 26, 20082008-02-26
Thanks to helps for everybody
Reply by Vladimir Vassilevsky●February 26, 20082008-02-26
icegray wrote:
>
>>Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
>>>>>>>>details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces,
>>>>>>>>audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded
>>>>>>>>linux,
>>>>>>>>maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
>>
>>>>>>>You need a Pentium class industrial PC with WinCE or Embedded XP.
>>
> What is the better sides of windows? Why windows is best choice?
Because CE simply works, and it is well supported and documented (as
opposed to linux incomprehensibility); finding all sorts of components
and drivers would not be a problem; most of it is plug and play type of
stuff (as opposed to do-it-yourself linux incompleteness); hiring the
sensible developers and mediocre supporters (as opposed to the
hysterical zealots of linux) would be a lot easier also.
BTW, I am involved in the design of the vehicle entertainment systems.
Being the OEM developer, you are liable for your software and hardware,
and you are required to use only the approved software and hardware
components, and there is a number of tests that your system have to
pass. The project that you are talking about weights several hundred
thousand lines in C++, this is a pretty serious endeavour so the amateur
approach is not feasible.
Vladimir Vassilevsky
DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant
http://www.abvolt.com
Reply by David Brown●February 26, 20082008-02-26
icegray wrote:
> On Feb 26, 12:27 am, David Brown
> <david.br...@hesbynett.removethisbit.no> wrote:
>> Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>>
>>> David Brown wrote:
>>>> Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>>>>>>>> I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
>>>>>>>> details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces,
>>>>>>>> audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded
>>>>>>>> linux,
>>>>>>>> maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
>>>>>>> You need a Pentium class industrial PC with WinCE or Embedded XP.
>>>>>> This feature is not absolute features. There are lots of arm based
>>>>>> mobile phones and they have this features expect high lcd resolution.
>>>>>> Also ARM9 developmet boards have almost this features.
>>>>> If you need the automotive infortaiment project to be built on time
>>>>> and done for good, you need a Pentium class industrial PC with WinCE
>>>>> or Embedded XP. If your real goal is to prove something, you may use
>>>>> ARM9, linux or whatsoever.
>>>> Isn't it scary enough that someone is designing an in-car computer
>>>> based on some vague ideas and advice from a newsgroup, without adding
>>>> windows on top?
>>> Not to worry. This is just another going to nowhere project which will
>>> be fortunately abandoned in a week or two. Or unfortunately abandoned in
>>> a year or two after spending several million of dollars. Nothing turns
>>> out to be more expensive then the so-called "free" stuff.
>> Expensive stuff can turn out to be expensive too - paying a lot is no
>> guarantee for success (though I agree that you're heading for disaster
>> if you base your decisions solely on the initial cost-price of your
>> tools). The expensive thing is a lack of knowledge, experience, and
>> planning in a project - not the cost of the tools or OS.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> What is your idea David? Which cpu is ideal for this kind of project?
> What is the better sides of windows? Why windows is best choice? I
> think Vladimir can not explain.
The cpu depends on the details of the system, the OS you are running,
and how much of the work is off-loaded to dedicated hardware such as
video accelerators. As for the "better sides of windows", I can't think
of any good sides of windows for a computer in a car - it's simply the
wrong choice when you want a reliable system. It is certainly possible
that a well-implemented wince system will be more stable and reliable
than a badly-implemented linux (for example) system, but if that's your
situation, you should not be implementing *any* system in a car.
Remember, if your system goes bananas it's not just the car radio that
stops working - you could give the driver incorrect information, you
could play horrible sounds at high volumes, you could block important
communication on the CAN bus, or do a number of other dangerous
mistakes. So your system needs to be very reliable - that's something
that embedded windows xp is totally unsuitable for, and wince is only
somewhat better. I'm not going to recommend anything - I don't have the
experience in this particular area. *You* have to do proper research
and investigation - don't believe salesmen, don't believe PHB's that
have fallen for the latest buzzwords, and don't believe what you read in
public newsgroups.
Reply by icegray●February 26, 20082008-02-26
On 26 =DEubat, 09:43, "badal_akr" <badal_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >On Feb 25, 8:32=3DA0pm, icegray <iceg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >> I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project
> >> details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces,
> >> audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded linux,
> >> maybe rear camera and gps, etc.
> >> I have been using Renesas M16C series as 16 bit Microcontroller and I
> >> need a powerfull 32bit CPU. I don't think use SuperH series because
> >> ARM9 has a lot of documets and sources i think. Freescale MX9328MX21S
> >> and Atmel SAM9263 or SAM9261 can better choices ? Could you please
> >> share your experiences about this subject?
> >> Thanks in advance
>
> >Check TI OMAP and TI DaVinci Processors.
> >They are excellent.
>
> >Karthik Balaguru
>
> I have never worked on the embedded linux.
> And even i am not aware of any phone available in the market on embedded
> linux. Can any body provide this information so that i can have a look on
> this.- Al=FDnt=FDy=FD gizle -
>
> - Al=FDnt=FDy=FD g=F6ster -