I'm looking for a simple, preferably through-hole H-bridge IC, nothing fancy, for PWM-controlled DC motor drive. (5A max would be plenty). Infineon TLE5205 ought to do the trick, but I don't understand how one would drive it. The truth table (IN1, IN2, OUT1, OUT2) is: 00:10 (forward) 01:01 (reverse) 10:00 (braking) 11:ZZ (freewheeling) I was expecting a direction input and a drive input. As it stands, if I PWM IN1 and set IN2 according to my desired output direction, I'll be PWMing between either free or braking according to whether I'm set for reverse or forward direction. Am I missing something here? Is the intention that I should add external logic to force IN2 high whenever IN1 is high?
H-bridges - what am I missing?
Started by ●September 19, 2010
Reply by ●September 19, 20102010-09-19
On 09/19/2010 12:43 PM, larwe wrote:> I'm looking for a simple, preferably through-hole H-bridge IC, nothing > fancy, for PWM-controlled DC motor drive. (5A max would be plenty). > Infineon TLE5205 ought to do the trick, but I don't understand how one > would drive it. The truth table (IN1, IN2, OUT1, OUT2) is: > > 00:10 (forward) > 01:01 (reverse) > 10:00 (braking) > 11:ZZ (freewheeling) > > I was expecting a direction input and a drive input. As it stands, if > I PWM IN1 and set IN2 according to my desired output direction, I'll > be PWMing between either free or braking according to whether I'm set > for reverse or forward direction. > > Am I missing something here? Is the intention that I should add > external logic to force IN2 high whenever IN1 is high?IIRC there are chips that do the logic such that you have a direction input and drive input. Most microcontrollers designed specifically for motor drive essentially put out a "gate on" command, which you are then expected to hook up to a gate driver and external FET. I have yet to find an all-in-one H-bridge chip that has drivers, logic that matches today's microcontrollers, and the capability to run in the tens of kHz. There may be one out there, but to date I've ended up either doing slow PWM or dropping FETs and drivers on my boards. (Note that if you've got a 5V supply to the motor that a 74ACTxx part makes a fairly good driver for an itty bitty FET. Otherwise you're looking at more traditional driver chips that require 12V or more supply, but will drive FETs capable of steering 100W or more around). -- Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com Do you need to implement control loops in software? "Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" was written for you. See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html
Reply by ●September 19, 20102010-09-19
On Sep 19, 3:43=A0pm, larwe <zwsdot...@gmail.com> wrote:> I'm looking for a simple, preferably through-hole H-bridge IC, nothing > fancy, for PWM-controlled DC motor drive. (5A max would be plenty). > Infineon TLE5205 ought to do the trick, but I don't understand how one > would drive it. The truth table (IN1, IN2, OUT1, OUT2) is: > > 00:10 (forward) > 01:01 (reverse) > 10:00 (braking) > 11:ZZ (freewheeling) > > I was expecting a direction input and a drive input. As it stands, if > I PWM IN1 and set IN2 according to my desired output direction, I'll > be PWMing between either free or braking according to whether I'm set > for reverse or forward direction. > > Am I missing something here? Is the intention that I should add > external logic to force IN2 high whenever IN1 is high?Sorry if I'm being dense Lewin, but this part is for driving a DC motor in one or the other direction, for example car electric window. Where does PWM come into it ? What kind of motor are you looking to control ? Thanks in advance for the clarification, Best Regards, Dave PS: careful on lead time of H-bridges - I'm having difficulty finding what we need that's actually obtainable...
Reply by ●September 19, 20102010-09-19
On 19.09.2010 21:43, larwe wrote:> I'm looking for a simple, preferably through-hole H-bridge IC, nothing > fancy, for PWM-controlled DC motor drive. (5A max would be plenty). > Infineon TLE5205 ought to do the trick, but I don't understand how one > would drive it.That may be caused by looking at not entirely the optimal IC for what you have in mind. I'll second Dave's assessment here: that IC appears to be intended for simple DC use, not for PWM'ed operation. The IC you're looking for would effectively need five output states (two different ones that end up as high-z) and thus _three_ inputs: e.g. direction, brake (for "00" state) and enable (turn off to reach "zz").> I was expecting a direction input and a drive input. As it stands, if > I PWM IN1 and set IN2 according to my desired output direction, I'll > be PWMing between either free or braking according to whether I'm set > for reverse or forward direction.You could PWM both inputs, and thus have PP:P0 --- PWM forward P0:0P --- PWM backward
Reply by ●September 19, 20102010-09-19
On Sep 19, 4:22=A0pm, Dave Nadler <d...@nadler.com> wrote:> > I'm looking for a simple, preferably through-hole H-bridge IC, nothing > > fancy, for PWM-controlled DC motor drive. (5A max would be plenty). > > Sorry if I'm being dense Lewin, but this part is for > driving a DC motor in one or the other direction, > for example car electric window.I need to drive a DC gearhead motor forward and reverse, with some speed control (2 or 3 steps in each direction). Fine control of motor speed is not necessary, and this is open loop. It would be a low frequency PWM signal, but the switching times mentioned in that specific datasheet seem to imply up to maybe 30kHz is theoretically doable. Control is from a general-purpose micro with two 10-bit PWM outputs and various available GPIOs. I could do what I want to do with discrete FETs but I don't want to have to design all the shoot-through protection, etc. etc. and worry about what I might have forgotten - much rather get a canned part.> PS: careful on lead time of H-bridges - I'm having > difficulty finding what we need that's actuallyI thought it was just me - almost all the parts I want are no stock everywhere...
Reply by ●September 19, 20102010-09-19
On 09/19/2010 05:28 PM, larwe wrote:> On Sep 19, 4:22 pm, Dave Nadler<d...@nadler.com> wrote: > >>> I'm looking for a simple, preferably through-hole H-bridge IC, nothing >>> fancy, for PWM-controlled DC motor drive. (5A max would be plenty). >> >> Sorry if I'm being dense Lewin, but this part is for >> driving a DC motor in one or the other direction, >> for example car electric window. > > I need to drive a DC gearhead motor forward and reverse, with some > speed control (2 or 3 steps in each direction). Fine control of motor > speed is not necessary, and this is open loop. It would be a low > frequency PWM signal, but the switching times mentioned in that > specific datasheet seem to imply up to maybe 30kHz is theoretically > doable. Control is from a general-purpose micro with two 10-bit PWM > outputs and various available GPIOs. > > I could do what I want to do with discrete FETs but I don't want to > have to design all the shoot-through protection, etc. etc. and worry > about what I might have forgotten - much rather get a canned part. > >> PS: careful on lead time of H-bridges - I'm having >> difficulty finding what we need that's actually > > I thought it was just me - almost all the parts I want are no stock > everywhere...If employers are afraid to hire even as the work picks up, I see no reason that manufacturers wouldn't be afraid to stock parts, even as demand picks up. Perhaps the "jobless recovery" is a "partless recovery" as well. -- Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com Do you need to implement control loops in software? "Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" was written for you. See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html
Reply by ●September 19, 20102010-09-19
On Sep 19, 8:47=A0pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote:> > I thought it was just me - almost all the parts I want are no stock > > everywhere... > > If employers are afraid to hire even as the work picks up, I see no > reason that manufacturers wouldn't be afraid to stock parts, even as > demand picks up. > > Perhaps the "jobless recovery" is a "partless recovery" as well.We have a serious problem with this at my day job - most of the big guys are giving us random leadtimes. I think the recovery is uncertain enough that it isn't a sure thing that it's going to be worthwhile to fire up a new shift or bring a spare fab online or whatever it is - the mfrs just don't want to sign up for increased fixed costs. On a related note, I found a device that has exactly the inputs I was expecting - National LMD18200. Seems like a very old part though.
Reply by ●September 20, 20102010-09-20
In article <9c51d5b3-ef28-4ea7-bfa2-5c8c0b981255 @k13g2000vbq.googlegroups.com>, zwsdotcom@gmail.com says...> On Sep 19, 8:47=A0pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote: >=20 > > > I thought it was just me - almost all the parts I want are no stock > > > everywhere... > > > > If employers are afraid to hire even as the work picks up, I see no > > reason that manufacturers wouldn't be afraid to stock parts, even as > > demand picks up. > > > > Perhaps the "jobless recovery" is a "partless recovery" as well. >=20 > We have a serious problem with this at my day job - most of the big > guys are giving us random leadtimes. I think the recovery is uncertain > enough that it isn't a sure thing that it's going to be worthwhile to > fire up a new shift or bring a spare fab online or whatever it is - > the mfrs just don't want to sign up for increased fixed costs. >=20 > On a related note, I found a device that has exactly the inputs I was > expecting - National LMD18200. Seems like a very old part though. >=20I don't know what you call old----but I have that part in systems designed in 2003 and it wasn't new when I first came across it. OTOH, it is still available through DigiKey---although it is currently out of stock and there won't be more until ~10/15/10. If you need one for testing and can't find an easy source, I have a leftover in the miscellaneous parts bin and can mail it to you. Mark Borgerson
Reply by ●September 20, 20102010-09-20
On Sun, 19 Sep 2010 17:52:46 -0700 (PDT), larwe <zwsdotcom@gmail.com> wrote:>On Sep 19, 8:47�pm, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote: > >> > I thought it was just me - almost all the parts I want are no stock >> > everywhere... >> >> If employers are afraid to hire even as the work picks up, I see no >> reason that manufacturers wouldn't be afraid to stock parts, even as >> demand picks up. >> >> Perhaps the "jobless recovery" is a "partless recovery" as well. > >We have a serious problem with this at my day job - most of the big >guys are giving us random leadtimes. I think the recovery is uncertain >enough that it isn't a sure thing that it's going to be worthwhile to >fire up a new shift or bring a spare fab online or whatever it is - >the mfrs just don't want to sign up for increased fixed costs. > >On a related note, I found a device that has exactly the inputs I was >expecting - National LMD18200. Seems like a very old part though.The even older L298N might also be viable. Stil available from multiple sources. In stock at Digikey. 60000 stock at Future Electronics. Regards Anton Erasmus
Reply by ●September 20, 20102010-09-20
On 09/20/2010 01:28 PM, Anton Erasmus wrote:> On Sun, 19 Sep 2010 17:52:46 -0700 (PDT), larwe<zwsdotcom@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> On Sep 19, 8:47 pm, Tim Wescott<t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote: >> >>>> I thought it was just me - almost all the parts I want are no stock >>>> everywhere... >>> >>> If employers are afraid to hire even as the work picks up, I see no >>> reason that manufacturers wouldn't be afraid to stock parts, even as >>> demand picks up. >>> >>> Perhaps the "jobless recovery" is a "partless recovery" as well. >> >> We have a serious problem with this at my day job - most of the big >> guys are giving us random leadtimes. I think the recovery is uncertain >> enough that it isn't a sure thing that it's going to be worthwhile to >> fire up a new shift or bring a spare fab online or whatever it is - >> the mfrs just don't want to sign up for increased fixed costs. >> >> On a related note, I found a device that has exactly the inputs I was >> expecting - National LMD18200. Seems like a very old part though. > > The even older L298N might also be viable. Stil available from > multiple sources. In stock at Digikey. > 60000 stock at Future Electronics. > > Regards > Anton ErasmusLovely part. Huge voltage drop compared to a MOSFET H-bridge. -- Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com Do you need to implement control loops in software? "Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" was written for you. See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html
