Doorbell "button"

On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:02:48 -0700, Don Y wrote:

> I'd thought of an immobil-IZED knocker that senses when it's been
> touched...
> and *released* (while not being "actuated") -- then, knocks by itself.
> Or, at the end of it's "stroke", results in a traditional door chime
> being sounded (instead of the expected "knock").

Have a super strong e-switched magnet at the knocker arm bottom that keeps 
it pinned to the door, and blurts out upon touch:  "Do I know you?", then 
releases after a couple seconds...  for a few seconds. Or alerts the face 
recognition system...   you...  yada yada yada... then you release it.

  The old way was a mechanical latch and solenoid release mechanism.

  Nowadays they keep entire doors shut with electro-magnets all the time, 
so keeping the knocker arm pinned would be easy.

On 2/23/2015 9:52 AM, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno wrote:
> On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 10:13:30 -0700, Don Y wrote:
>
>> On 2/23/2015 8:22 AM, adule wrote:
>>
>>>> So, how would you "confound" someone interacting with your door for
>>>> the first time?

Make 'em use linux to ring the doorbell.  Let them figure out
the CLI command required to do so.

>>>
>>> One button. When pressed, it announces,"We are currently experiencing
>>> heavy door bell ringer traffic. Please wait. You are number 1 in the
>>> door bell ringer waiting queue."
>>
>> Ooooo... I *like* that!  Followed by "Musak" and the occasional
>> "commercial" ("Ask about our limited time offer: ...  BUT WAIT! There's
>> more!  If you act now, we'll greet you with not one, but *two*
>> residents!  -- just pay separate shipping and handling...")
>
> Separate 'discounted' door answering and conversation fees. "This offer
> only available if you take both..."
>
>    I like my video display Idea, but thinking a bit, I think you should
> build a huge, gazebo like front porch structure with steel panel slamming
> "windows" (ala The Forbidden Planet) and entry door that


makes the visitor
> feel like he or she is 100% at your mercy.

Why is that not surprising?
>
>    As a a sci fi option, you could have one window remain 'open' but lead
> to a disintegration chamber.  :-) (no muss, no fuss)
>
>    'Unsuspectima victima' on a placard over the window.
>

On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 10:14:54 -0800, mike wrote:

> Make 'em use linux to ring the doorbell.  Let them figure out the CLI
> command required to do so.

  The fucktard mike should get smitten upon the face for his lowlife, 
fucktarded, dishonorable trek through life.

  FOAD, immature punk fuck.  and no...  I do not care that YOU think that 
you were "just joking".

On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 00:25:12 -0700, Don Y <this@is.not.me.com> wrote:

>That would encourage "retaliation".  You want to discourage people
>without pissing them off -- else you have to worry about their
>future actions!

Hardly.  You've presented them with a challenge to be met and provided
a diversion from the normally boring and frustrating task of selling
door to door.  

>Years ago, there was an arcade piece (perhaps a shooter?) that cached
>the player's quarter.  If you "won" (beat some score, etc.), YOUR coin
>was refunded to you.  Amusing how often folks wouldn't realize that
>this *could* (and DID!) happen!  Anyone "in the know" would routinely
>probe the coin mech after a player left the game in the hope that
>the player was one such "dweeb"!

My version of that was setting up flat bed scanners for customers.  At
the time, such scanners were fairly new and few mortals knew how they
operated.  I would set up the scanner, install the software, and then
fumble around looking for something to scan.  There's nothing better
than scanning money, so I would dive into my wallet and proclaim that
it's empty.  I would then ask the customer for a $20 bill to scan. The
scanner demonstration and tutorial would normally last about 15-30
minutes, during which time the customer would invariably forget about
his $20 bill, which I would pocket when done.  Unfortunately, I'm
disgustingly honest and would later confess to the theft, or give a
$20 credit on the bill.  Unfortunately, this can no longer be done.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EURion_constellation>

Now, back to your doorbell.  Perhaps what you need is just a 12 button
keypad (calculator style, not telephone style).  Push ANY button, and
it rings the doorbell.  My guess(tm) is that a random visitor, who has
not been previously informed of the trick, will hesitate and not push
any of the buttons.  Mission accomplished and you have your
salesperson deterrent.


-- 
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 17:38:11 +0000 (UTC), DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
<DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> wrote:

>On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 09:06:01 -0800, John Larkin wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 22 Feb 2015 19:12:39 -0700, Don Y <this@is.not.me.com> wrote:
>
>>>
>>>So, how would you "confound" someone interacting with your door for the
>>>first time?
>> 
>> 
>> Pretty weird.
>
>
>  Beyond the friggin fringe weird.
>
>  Just build an armored box, and put an armored glass in front of it, and 
>stick a display in there.  Show "pop up" videos of folks you dislike 
>seeing at your door, and some staged responses, like decpitations, etc..
>
>  The folks you expect to see, you inform about the videos, and they know 
>where the real doorbell is to announce their arrival with.
>
>  The uninvited stand there jaw dropped, in awe, watching the 'snuff 
>video'.
>
>  You could even post a go-pro camera aspect shot of a person approaching 
>your door and watching one of the videos.  It would probably go viral as 
>the new way to deter foul would-be trespassers...   without ever lifting a 
>finger.

Even weirder.

We have a doorbell/intercom. When people ring, we can ask them what
they want. If it's not interesting, we say "no, thank you" and switch
them off.


-- 

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing   precision measurement 

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Hi Frank,

On 2/23/2015 10:15 AM, Frnak McKenney wrote:

> Since you plan on using some alternative method for detecting people at

Yes.  I need to be able to "authenticate" certain visitors so can't
rely on something as "dumb" as a doorbell to tell me that!

Likewise, I don't want the "annunciator" to actually *signal* a
visitor's presence.  Rather, just an "input" that I can respond to
as I see fit.  And, ideally, providing feedback to the visitor
ALSO "as I see fit" -- so, I can let them think they've "rung the
bell (or not) regardless of whether or not I've actually been
"disturbed"/alerted by it.

> the door, how about installing one (or more?) of these:
>
>    http://www.broughtons.com/store/department/1/Bells/
>    http://www.reminis.co.uk/mechanical-bells-pulls.html
>
> but rig them up to be non-functional?

They'd be "unconventional" but wouldn't really "confound".  Sort of like
making a door knocker out of *glass* ("Gee, that's unusual!" -- but they
would still KNOW its purpose)

> Or, make them trigger an electronic response (ring, ding, or a TV-Addams-
> Family beeee-yoooup) that can only be heard _outside_ the door? Regular
> visitors would know that they have to operate exactly two of the devices,

Remember, it can't be too much of a novelty.  I don't want to encourage
people to "show their friends".  E.g., a teeny-tiny little bell that
"rings" like a large GONG!

I want to leave them "uneasy" rather than "amused".

> say.  I especially like the image of someone pulling the line on one of
> those ship's bells and hearing it (say) ring like a telephone. <grin>

(flush) Lever off a toilet?  (and a little suspicious "puddle" nearby
that they *will* avoid getting their feet in!)

> On the other hand, that "deer rump" button someone suggested would be a
> nice touch.

On 2/23/2015 3:33 AM, Tom Gardner wrote:
> On 23/02/15 02:12, Don Y wrote:
>> I.e., the point is to force first-time visitors (e.g., solicitors)
>> to pause and have to think about how to proceed -- set them back
>> on their heels, momentarily.  ("regulars" won't think twice about
>> any scheme I come up with AFTER their first encounter)
>
> My daughter has had considerable success with a sign that
> simply says "No leaflets please. We actively boycott any
> business that posts leaflets".
>
> I suspect you could adapt that.

I think right pondian culture may be different.  Here, a "polite
notice" would have very little effect.

The *neighborhood* has a prominent notice:  "No Soliciting"
It isn't worth the paper it was printed on!  :-/

Folks routinely walk through the neighborhood knocking on EVERY
door trying to peddle <whatever>.

"Hi, we're in the neighborhood replacing one of your neighbor's
windows..."  (Oh, really?  WHICH NEIGHBOR?  Wouldn't I be smarter
to wait until you are DONE and then ask that neighbor for his
opinion of your product and workmanship?  How does my "purchase"
BEFORE the fact work to my benefit??)

"We're going to be repainting the house numbers on the street
curb and want to know if you'd like yours done, as well?"
(Do I look like I have trouble finding *my* house?  Did
you not notice the large brass numerals prominently affixed
to the house above the garage door?)

"Hi, we're (not from this part of town, but) trying to send our
class to <wherever>.  Would you consider buying some overpriced
candy to help us (and, if we sell ENOUGH of it, we'll be sure
to come back next year to pester you suckers^H^H^H kind folks
for <whatever> we plan on doing, then!)"

"Hi, we're trying to get an issue on the ballot to limit
the ability of people to put issues on the ballot.  Would
you care to sign our petition?"

"Hi, I'm Joe Shmoe.  I'm running for <dogcatcher>.  I wonder
if I could have a moment of your time to discuss my candidacy?"

[These are (paraphrased) ACTUAL encounters we've had, here]

I think their reasoning is something along the lines of:
Heck, I'm *here*.  Any house I *don't* visit makes this
a less profitable undertaking than I had hoped.  BOTHERING
the homeowners can't possibly be any worse than NOT MAKING
MY PITCH TO THEM (i.e., no pitch == no sale; bothering
them at least has the *possibility* of a sale!  They just
haven't yet realized that they want what I am selling!!)

We get robocalls for the same item(s), repeatedly.  E.g.,
once a week for 6 or 8 *months*.  "Um, what makes you
think I will want it *this* time when I haven't wanted it any
of the past *25* times you've called??"

Again, easier/safer to place the call (and annoy the callee)
than to AVOID placing the call (and DEFINITELY losing the
sale).

[I have yet to find a good FXS/FXO adapter to "fix" the
phone system]

> I've had some success with a sign saying "Not Foobar Rd".
> That was necessary because I was repeatedly having deliveries
> for "Foobar Close" The worst "delivery" was scaffolding
> up to the roof! The contractor was even less amused than
> I was.
>
> Satnav's didn't show Foobar Close, presumably since it
> had only been there for 80 years. Maybe after a century...

We routinely encounter bicyclists trying to "cut the corner"
(two major cross streets) by traveling through our neighborhood.
I'm not sure if they are getting this information from a
GPS unit (navigation aid) *or* just 'reasoning" that there
*should* be a way through the neighborhood.

They are invariably annoyed when they encounter the gate that
the subdivision behind us has installed across the roadway
connecting our subdivisions (it's been there for at least 20
years -- but still appears as a navigable road on GPS maps!).

So, instead of a shortcut, they end up putting in an extra mile
to get into the subdivision, encounter the gate and then have
to get back *out*!

[Some years back, a fellow who had assaulted his girlfriend
drove through the neighborhood to evade police -- carjacking
another neighbor's vehicle in the process.  "Shortcut".  Boy,
was he surprised when he found himself in an area with no outlet!]

On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 12:12:39 +1000, Don Y <this@is.not.me.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> [Amusing that we tend to call the *button* and the *annunciator*
> "The Doorbell"!  :-/ ]
>
> Anyway...
>
> I'm looking for an unusual idea as to how to implement the
> "button" portion of a (home) "doorbell".  I.e., the interface
> that is presented to the *visitor*.
>
> Note that this need not be electronic.  Or, could be some
> perversion of an electronic adaptation of a *mechanical*
> device.
>
> Goal is to "mess with the heads" of (first-time) callers
> (I expect folks who visit often to quickly understand the
> mechanism).
>
> Note that actually *knowing* that a visitor is "at the door"
> is not an issue -- I can do that a number of different ways.
> What I am actually interested in is how the *visitor* thinks
> he has to signal his presence.
>
> The sorts of things I've been exploring:
> - a "knocker" that is not movable (no "hinge")
> - a knocker that is hinged at the *bottom*
> - a knocker that "fights back"
> - a knocker that "makes no noise"
> - a knocker that FALLS OFF when actuated
> - a "button" that you *pull* (Addam's Family)
> - a button that isn't "pushable"
> - a *group* of buttons ("which one do I press??")
> - a numeric keypad ("what do I *type*??")
> - a telephone *dial* ("WTF??")
> - a coin slot (or dollar bill validator!  :> )
> - a big red "HAL" eye
> - "In case of Emergency, break glass" (with LEXAN :> )
>
> etc.  (I've heard some REALLY off-the-wall ideas that I won't even
> mention, here  :> )
>
> [Remember, I am not interested in how you would *sense* the
> visitor's action -- that's typically easy]
>
> I.e., the point is to force first-time visitors (e.g., solicitors)
> to pause and have to think about how to proceed -- set them back
> on their heels, momentarily.  ("regulars" won't think twice about
> any scheme I come up with AFTER their first encounter)
>
> So, how would you "confound" someone interacting with your
> door for the first time?

A timer with an LCD message - "your knock has been recorded and will be  
forwarded in 30 seconds - please wait."

"29 seconds -please wait." etc

or just use a numbered chit system "Please take a number and go away"

On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 12:12:39 +1000, Don Y <this@is.not.me.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> [Amusing that we tend to call the *button* and the *annunciator*
> "The Doorbell"!  :-/ ]
>
> Anyway...
>
> I'm looking for an unusual idea as to how to implement the
> "button" portion of a (home) "doorbell".  I.e., the interface
> that is presented to the *visitor*.
>
> Note that this need not be electronic.  Or, could be some
> perversion of an electronic adaptation of a *mechanical*
> device.
>
> Goal is to "mess with the heads" of (first-time) callers
> (I expect folks who visit often to quickly understand the
> mechanism).
>
> Note that actually *knowing* that a visitor is "at the door"
> is not an issue -- I can do that a number of different ways.
> What I am actually interested in is how the *visitor* thinks
> he has to signal his presence.
>
> The sorts of things I've been exploring:
> - a "knocker" that is not movable (no "hinge")
> - a knocker that is hinged at the *bottom*
> - a knocker that "fights back"
> - a knocker that "makes no noise"
> - a knocker that FALLS OFF when actuated
> - a "button" that you *pull* (Addam's Family)
> - a button that isn't "pushable"
> - a *group* of buttons ("which one do I press??")
> - a numeric keypad ("what do I *type*??")
> - a telephone *dial* ("WTF??")
> - a coin slot (or dollar bill validator!  :> )
> - a big red "HAL" eye
> - "In case of Emergency, break glass" (with LEXAN :> )
>
> etc.  (I've heard some REALLY off-the-wall ideas that I won't even
> mention, here  :> )
>
> [Remember, I am not interested in how you would *sense* the
> visitor's action -- that's typically easy]
>
> I.e., the point is to force first-time visitors (e.g., solicitors)
> to pause and have to think about how to proceed -- set them back
> on their heels, momentarily.  ("regulars" won't think twice about
> any scheme I come up with AFTER their first encounter)
>
> So, how would you "confound" someone interacting with your
> door for the first time?

A doorbell button that looks like it is the trigger of a mouse trap.

On 2/23/2015 12:31 PM, David Eather wrote:

> or just use a numbered chit system "Please take a number and go away"

Ha!