What is the best USB-to-RS232 adapter out there?

In article <44672913.2FDBE7F4@yahoo.com>,
CBFalconer  <cbfalconer@maineline.net> wrote:
>David Brown wrote:


>> What bugs me most with modern laptops is that they often lack a
>> parallel port.  For most uses, a USB-based serial port will work
>> perfectly well (and it's easy to add several), but for simple,
>> cheap and easy-to-use programming adaptors nothing beats the
>> parallel port.

That's true if you need an easy-to-use programing adaptor. Unfortunately
most folks don't.

>There are three essentials that are missing from far too many
>machines.

Qualify that for embedded systems developers and hobbyists.

>  If the public simply insisted on them they would be
>present.

And once you qualify it, you see why they are disappearing.

>  All are cheap.

However, each cost real estate on an already cramped laptop. Also
for the most part, their original purpose has been obsoleted. Let's
examine each in turn.

>  1.  Real serial port(s)

Designed to hook up external modems, mice, and terminals. Modems are 
all internal now for the most part. The ones that are not are USB.
Mice turned from serial ports years ago. Virtually all are USB now.
Terminals are a specialty item in both directions. Using a PC as a
terminal has been transferred to a network function. Using a terminal
with a PC has been a non-started under DOS/Windows even though I've
done it on occasion with my Linux boxes over the years.

In short unless you are an embedded systems developer or a user of
some type of serial port based instrumentation, the serial port
has become an appendix. Finally if you really need a serial port,
the $10 USB-serial adaptor will fill 90% of the needs without occupying
any additional space.

So there's no longer a public need for a real serial port.

It's a sad requiem, but a true one.

>  2.  Real parallel port(s)

Ditto. Name me one modern printer that actually carries a parallel
interface? Good luck!

The general public used printer ports to attach printers. That was their
only purpose. For us embedded systems folks it served as an easy to use,
easy to attach digital interface. But that's not its intended purpose, which
as now been transferred to USB.

Parallel is dead too. I mourn its loss. I finally have a laptop with no
parallel port.

>  3.  ECC memory.

You'd have a tough time explaining to the GP what ECC is all about. Then
you'd have to explain that it'll crash your application when your memory
is altered instead of giving incorrect output. Then you'll get laughed
out the building! ;-)

Everything about PC hardware/software is about being good enough. SCSI
was superior. IDE was good enough. real serial and parallel are better.
USB is good enough. ECC memory? Non ECC was/is good enough.

So I'm learning to live with the limitations. I'm working on new interfaces
for my Trivial PIC programmers (http://www.finitesite.com/d3jsys) because
I know that legacy port free PCs will become the norm very soon. This
includes a serial bootstrap programmer that only uses TX/RX so that it
works with all USB/serial cables including ones with poor timing between
modem control and data transmission. I'm also considering a programmer that
uses keyboard LEDs blinking in sequence to do the programming. Each of
these can be used to bootstrap a USB enabled PIC so that an intelligent
USB based loader/bootloader can be contsructed.


>The first two are for usability, the last for reliability.

Useability and reliability for whom? Certainly not the GP.

BAJ

On 14 May, in article <e47hak$8f@cleon.cc.gatech.edu>
     byron@cc.gatech.edu "Byron A Jeff" wrote:

>In article <44672913.2FDBE7F4@yahoo.com>,
>CBFalconer  <cbfalconer@maineline.net> wrote:
>>David Brown wrote:
>
>
>>> What bugs me most with modern laptops is that they often lack a
>>> parallel port.  For most uses, a USB-based serial port will work
>>> perfectly well (and it's easy to add several), but for simple,
>>> cheap and easy-to-use programming adaptors nothing beats the
>>> parallel port.
>
>That's true if you need an easy-to-use programing adaptor. Unfortunately
>most folks don't.
>
>>There are three essentials that are missing from far too many
>>machines.
>
>Qualify that for embedded systems developers and hobbyists.
>
>>  If the public simply insisted on them they would be
>>present.
>
>And once you qualify it, you see why they are disappearing.

Some are coming back on the devices.

>>  All are cheap.
>
>However, each cost real estate on an already cramped laptop. Also
>for the most part, their original purpose has been obsoleted. Let's
>examine each in turn.

The connectors are the major real estate.

>>  2.  Real parallel port(s)
>
>Ditto. Name me one modern printer that actually carries a parallel
>interface? Good luck!

You obviously think a printer is one of those ink jet abominations!
Most notably, Brother in the last 18 months had to bring out models
with standard printer ports from customer pressure as many places use
print servers.

Most laser printers (not meant as a GDI pseudo printer) actually these
days actually have 1284 and USB, then network devices have RJ45 as well.

>The general public used printer ports to attach printers. That was their
>only purpose. For us embedded systems folks it served as an easy to use,
>easy to attach digital interface. But that's not its intended purpose, which
>as now been transferred to USB.

The corporate and other organisations tend to prefer parallel or network
printers, if nothing else USB printer drivers are a real pain in a network
for inability to cope with OS changes or in some cases not be useable over
a network.

>Parallel is dead too. I mourn its loss. I finally have a laptop with no
>parallel port.

Laptops will always have minimal connectors as it means real estate for
connectors and holes in the casing. Printers are still available with
parallel interfaces.

-- 
Paul Carpenter          | paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk
<http://www.pcserviceselectronics.co.uk/>    PC Services
<http://www.gnuh8.org.uk/>              GNU H8 & mailing list info
<http://www.badweb.org.uk/>             For those web sites you hate

CBFalconer wrote:
> David Brown wrote:
> ... snip ...
>> What bugs me most with modern laptops is that they often lack a
>> parallel port.  For most uses, a USB-based serial port will work
>> perfectly well (and it's easy to add several), but for simple,
>> cheap and easy-to-use programming adaptors nothing beats the
>> parallel port.
> 
> There are three essentials that are missing from far too many
> machines.  If the public simply insisted on them they would be
> present.  All are cheap.
> 
>   1.  Real serial port(s)
>   2.  Real parallel port(s)
>   3.  ECC memory.
> 
> The first two are for usability, the last for reliability.
> 

There's a forth thing missing from many laptops - a reset switch.  When 
windows BSODs, or something hangs the machine, you have to take the 
battery out.

A fifth thing that some, but not all, laptops have is a clear physical 
switch to disable the WiFi interface.

"David Brown" <david@westcontrol.removethisbit.com> wrote in message
news:4468251c@news.wineasy.se...
> There's a forth thing missing from many laptops - a reset switch.  When
> windows BSODs, or something hangs the machine, you have to take the
> battery out.

All the laptops I have had so far had a power switch that powered down from
any crash when pressed for 5 seconds.

Meindert

In article <4468251c@news.wineasy.se>, David Brown <david@westcontrol.re
movethisbit.com> writes
>CBFalconer wrote:
>> David Brown wrote:
>> ... snip ...
>>> What bugs me most with modern laptops is that they often lack a
>>> parallel port.  For most uses, a USB-based serial port will work
>>> perfectly well (and it's easy to add several), but for simple,
>>> cheap and easy-to-use programming adaptors nothing beats the
>>> parallel port.
>> 
>> There are three essentials that are missing from far too many
>> machines.  If the public simply insisted on them they would be
>> present.  All are cheap.
>> 
>>   1.  Real serial port(s)
>>   2.  Real parallel port(s)

The public don't want serial as they have USB and "nothing uses serial
anymore" :-(

Also "all printers" use USB now...

The problem is the majority market don't use modems, eprom programmers
and Jtag's. they don't need termial windows on com1 :-(  There are some
laptops with serial and parallel ports on byt they are few and far
between usually the high end ones as it is cheaper to put several USB
ports on a laptop.


I have several times thought about marketing my own brand of laptops
with RS232 and parallel ports on for the very reasons you sight. The
problem is they could not be as inexpensive as the normal ones. The
sheer volume brings the price down. 

>>   3.  ECC memory.
>> The first two are for usability, the last for reliability.
>> 
>
>There's a forth thing missing from many laptops - a reset switch.  When 
>windows BSODs, or something hangs the machine, you have to take the 
>battery out.

Too true. but switches cost money.

>A fifth thing that some, but not all, laptops have is a clear physical 
>switch to disable the WiFi interface.


That is essential. 

-- 
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills  Staffs  England     /\/\/\/\/
/\/\/ chris@phaedsys.org      www.phaedsys.org \/\/\
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

On Mon, 15 May 2006 10:26:15 +0200, the renowned "Meindert Sprang"
<ms@NOJUNKcustomORSPAMware.nl> wrote:

>"David Brown" <david@westcontrol.removethisbit.com> wrote in message
>news:4468251c@news.wineasy.se...
>> There's a forth thing missing from many laptops - a reset switch.  When
>> windows BSODs, or something hangs the machine, you have to take the
>> battery out.
>
>All the laptops I have had so far had a power switch that powered down from
>any crash when pressed for 5 seconds.
>
>Meindert

The older Toshiba ones I've used have a hard reset switch behind a
small hole in the case. You poke something in there to reset the
machine. 


Best regards, 
Spehro Pefhany
-- 
"it's the network..."                          "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com

On 14-May-2006, David Brown <david@westcontrol.removethisbit.com> wrote:

> What bugs me most with modern laptops is that they often lack a parallel
> port.  For most uses, a USB-based serial port will work perfectly well
> (and it's easy to add several), but for simple, cheap and easy-to-use
> programming adaptors nothing beats the parallel port.

I bought a new laptop awile ago. One store that I visited had all of the
laptops bolted down to the display in such a way that you couldn't see the
rear connectors. I asked the pimple faced kid working there which ones had a
parallel port. He said "whats that".

Unfortunately, I travel with a a few parallel port dongles. Serial ports are
not a problem (the USB adapters work fine for me).

-Hershel

Hershel Roberson wrote:
> On 14-May-2006, David Brown <david@westcontrol.removethisbit.com>
> wrote:
>
>> What bugs me most with modern laptops is that they often lack a
>> parallel port.  For most uses, a USB-based serial port will work
>> perfectly well (and it's easy to add several), but for simple, cheap
>> and easy-to-use programming adaptors nothing beats the parallel port.
>
> I bought a new laptop awile ago. One store that I visited had all of
> the laptops bolted down to the display in such a way that you
> couldn't see the rear connectors. I asked the pimple faced kid
> working there which ones had a parallel port. He said "whats that".
>
> Unfortunately, I travel with a a few parallel port dongles. Serial
> ports are not a problem (the USB adapters work fine for me).
>

PC-Card parallel port?
http://www.transdigital.net/info.htm   - Did not test it myself though.
Has 25 pin connector.

I thought of this solution when I was looking for a laptop last year.
I managed to get one of the last HP NW8000's with parallel+serial
before they were obsoleted last year.

Nice machine, I really like the 7th motherboard I recently got installed :-)


> -Hershel

-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
ulf@a-t-m-e-l.com
This message is intended to be my own personal view and it
may or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB 

On 2006-05-15, Ulf Samuelsson <ulf@a-t-m-e-l.com> wrote:


> I thought of this solution when I was looking for a laptop
> last year. I managed to get one of the last HP NW8000's with
> parallel+serial before they were obsoleted last year.
>
> Nice machine, I really like the 7th motherboard I recently got
> installed :-)

I'm jealous.  My laptop only holds 1 motherboard.

-- 
Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow!  Look! A ladder! Maybe
                                  at               it leads to heaven, or
                               visi.com            a sandwich!