Forums

interesting info from Atmel

Started by tsvetanusunov May 28, 2004
On Thu, Jun 03, 2004 at 11:13:57PM -0000, lpc2100_fan wrote:
> btw. I am also convinced that Philips will come out with ARM9 devices
> but I doubt they will be too similar to the Atmel devices.

I see one difference: Atmel parts are all in big and expensive (considering
PCB and soldering) casings (BGA). The smallest Atmel part is in
a TQFP100, whereas the smallest Philips one is a LQFP48.
I hope we will see even smaller ARM's (probably 20 pins devices?).
A 8-pin ARM7 would also be useful.

M.




An Engineer's Guide to the LPC2100 Series

--- In , Matthias Weingart <lpc2000@p...>
wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 03, 2004 at 11:13:57PM -0000, lpc2100_fan wrote:
> > btw. I am also convinced that Philips will come out with ARM9
devices
> > but I doubt they will be too similar to the Atmel devices.
>
> I see one difference: Atmel parts are all in big and expensive
(considering
> PCB and soldering) casings (BGA). The smallest Atmel part is in
> a TQFP100, whereas the smallest Philips one is a LQFP48.
> I hope we will see even smaller ARM's (probably 20 pins devices?).
> A 8-pin ARM7 would also be useful.
>
> M.

Where would an 8 pin ARM7 cpu be useful?


--- In , Matthias Weingart <lpc2000@p...>
wrote:
> I hope we will see even smaller ARM's (probably 20 pins devices?).
> A 8-pin ARM7 would also be useful.

8-pin ARM7 is joke right? power supply + JTAG port and no GPIO ;)
even the LPC2106 seems to have a lot of ports but when you enable
JTAG you loose half of it's GPIO port

Best regards
Tsvetan
---
PCB prototypes for $26 at http://run.to/pcb
(http://www.olimex.com/pcb)
PCB any volume assembly (http://www.olimex.com/pcb/protoa.html)
Development boards for ARM, AVR, PIC, and MSP430
(http://www.olimex.com/dev)



Tsvetan,

> wrote:
> > I hope we will see even smaller ARM's (probably 20 pins devices?).
> > A 8-pin ARM7 would also be useful.
>
> 8-pin ARM7 is joke right? power supply + JTAG port and no
> GPIO ;) even the LPC2106 seems to have a lot of ports but
> when you enable
> JTAG you loose half of it's GPIO port

8-pin ARM 7 with serial debug over the /RST line is possible--Atmel have
already introduced debugWIRE for then tinyAVR devices, so why not just
introduce it for ultra-small SAM devices?

--
Paul Curtis, Rowley Associates Ltd http://www.rowley.co.uk
CrossWorks for MSP430, ARM, and (soon) Atmel AVR processors



On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 11:53:06AM -0000, tsvetanusunov wrote:
> --- In , Matthias Weingart <lpc2000@p...>
> wrote:
> > I hope we will see even smaller ARM's (probably 20 pins devices?).
> > A 8-pin ARM7 would also be useful.
>
> 8-pin ARM7 is joke right? power supply + JTAG port and no GPIO ;)
> even the LPC2106 seems to have a lot of ports but when you enable
> JTAG you loose half of it's GPIO port

Of course programming should be different. Just one pin is enough
to load code (internal bootloader working over a one pin bidirectional
interface is technically seen no problem).

Matthias



At 11:53 AM 6/4/04 +0000, you wrote:
>--- In , Matthias Weingart <lpc2000@p...>
>wrote:
> > I hope we will see even smaller ARM's (probably 20 pins devices?).
> > A 8-pin ARM7 would also be useful.
>
>8-pin ARM7 is joke right? power supply + JTAG port and no GPIO ;)
>even the LPC2106 seems to have a lot of ports but when you enable
>JTAG you loose half of it's GPIO port

I don't know about 8 but I can see applications for something like 12-16
pins. Sensorless Vector motor control comes to mind (usually considered a
DSP app).

Robert

" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself. There are always restrictions,
be they legal, genetic, or physical. If you don't believe me, try to
chew a radio signal. "

Kelvin Throop, III


Rene,

the announcement is for the SJA 2020 which is an ARM7 product.
Everything else on the flyer is a so called roadmap. Things that can
be done if enough request is there from the market. Keep in mind that
the LPC2000 microcontrollers and the SJA 2020 come from different
groups within Philips, hence the very different naming. While the
LPC2000 devices have been available to the "public" for quite a while
now, I don't know about samples of the SJA 2020 yet. Most likely there
are samples for key automotive customers because the SJA2020 has been
developed by the Automotive group. The LPC2000 family is from the
"General Purpose Microcontroller" group and target markets are many
because it is general purpose.

Cheers, Bob

--- In , "exh_rene" <exh_rene@y...> wrote:
> --- In , "trick260173" <trick260173@y...>
> wrote:
> > According to me, you will see New Philips Standard ARM Products
> based
> > on ARM920T and ARM926EJS core, like ATMEL Family has already now. >
> ARM9 has already been announced (by Philips) for the automotive
> family (2004/2005):
> http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/acrobat/literature/9397/75012509
> .pdf





> PS,PS: just curious - could you give a "Real-Worl" example
> of an appliction for an 8-pin ARM7, where a 8-bit MCU wouldn't do??

Neuro processor that can be connected to other ARM7 neuro processors using
fast and simple serial protocol (I call it NeuroBus) in order to achieve
neural networks with unlimited number of neurons - depends on how much money
you can invest in your neural network. There should be two separate serial
communication lines. First one to connect to previous layer of neurons and
second one to connect to next layer of neurons. If NeuroBus is implemented
in hardware then you might end up with some veeeerrrryyyy fast neural
networks based on ARM7 MCUs in 8-pin package. Quartz should be integrated
on-chip. There is no need for 3.3V since 1.8V might be enough for NeuroBus
serial IO lines. Having 256 bytes of integrated EEPROM could be good
solution for saving synaptic weights - otherwise power-down will erase
current neural network training. Etc...

I just hope that someone from Philips is actually reading this :))

Regards,
Igor


Hi Bob,

I'm aware of the different groups and target markets (different
requirements). The flyer indicates ARM9 for 2004(end) and 2005.
Although it might be a different group it indicates the direction. I
can imagine that the LPC series will have something simular.
And imho if you plan an ARM9 for end this year .. you better start
developing yesterday :-) Btw; 2020 samples are available since the
end of last year - but very likely to key customers only (mass
production in 2004/Q4). --- In , "lpc2100_fan" <lpc2100_fan@y...>
wrote:
> Rene,
>
> the announcement is for the SJA 2020 which is an ARM7 product.
> Everything else on the flyer is a so called roadmap. Things that can
> be done if enough request is there from the market. Keep in mind
that
> the LPC2000 microcontrollers and the SJA 2020 come from different
> groups within Philips, hence the very different naming. While the
> LPC2000 devices have been available to the "public" for quite a
while
> now, I don't know about samples of the SJA 2020 yet. Most likely
there
> are samples for key automotive customers because the SJA2020 has
been
> developed by the Automotive group. The LPC2000 family is from the
> "General Purpose Microcontroller" group and target markets are many
> because it is general purpose.
>
> Cheers, Bob
>
> --- In , "exh_rene" <exh_rene@y...> wrote:
> > --- In , "trick260173" <trick260173@y...>
> > wrote:
> > > According to me, you will see New Philips Standard ARM Products
> > based
> > > on ARM920T and ARM926EJS core, like ATMEL Family has already
now.
> >
> >
> >
> > ARM9 has already been announced (by Philips) for the automotive
> > family (2004/2005):
> >
http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/acrobat/literature/9397/75012509
> > .pdf





--- In , "exh_rene" <exh_rene@y...> wrote:
> Hi Bob,
>
> I'm aware of the different groups and target markets (different
> requirements). The flyer indicates ARM9 for 2004(end) and 2005.
> Although it might be a different group it indicates the direction.
I
> can imagine that the LPC series will have something simular.
> And imho if you plan an ARM9 for end this year .. you better start
> developing yesterday :-) Btw; 2020 samples are available since the
> end of last year - but very likely to key customers only (mass
> production in 2004/Q4). > --- In , "lpc2100_fan" <lpc2100_fan@y...>
> wrote:
> > Rene,
> >
> > the announcement is for the SJA 2020 which is an ARM7 product.
> > Everything else on the flyer is a so called roadmap. Things that
can
> > be done if enough request is there from the market. Keep in mind
> that
> > the LPC2000 microcontrollers and the SJA 2020 come from different
> > groups within Philips, hence the very different naming. While the
> > LPC2000 devices have been available to the "public" for quite a
> while
> > now, I don't know about samples of the SJA 2020 yet. Most likely
> there
> > are samples for key automotive customers because the SJA2020 has
> been
> > developed by the Automotive group. The LPC2000 family is from the
> > "General Purpose Microcontroller" group and target markets are
many
> > because it is general purpose.
> >
> > Cheers, Bob
> >
> > --- In , "exh_rene" <exh_rene@y...> wrote:
> > > --- In , "trick260173"
<trick260173@y...>
> > > wrote:
> > > > According to me, you will see New Philips Standard ARM
Products
> > > based
> > > > on ARM920T and ARM926EJS core, like ATMEL Family has already
> now.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ARM9 has already been announced (by Philips) for the automotive
> > > family (2004/2005):
> > >
>
http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/acrobat/literature/9397/75012509
> > > .pdf

I was talking about STANDARD ARM9 Products ONLY, like the AT91RM9200
from ATMEL. It is not the same than an ARM9 for Automotive. Several
companies have a product with ARM7/9, but most of them are ASSP.

Greetings.