Howdy Everybody:
Is it advisable to use the RCM6700 and RCM6710 in new designs?
I'm getting to be an older electronics engineer, but I can still lean new
tricks. :-) I have several (about10) ageing (10-12 years old) circuit board
designs based on the Motorola (Freescale) MC68HC11F1 16MHz 8Bit Microcontroller.
I need to update these designs because the HC11 is being discontinued. I would
like to get another 10+ years on my updated circuit board designs...
In this design refresh cycle, I need to maintain customer level reverse
compatibility, but also I am looking to add/expand the existing feature set.
Things like adding TCP/IP (Ethernet / Web) options, vastly more battery backed
ram, considerably more CPU horse power, etc...
I spent the weekend reviewing every document on the Rabbit 6000, Dynamic C 10,
and the modules themselves I could find. The RCM6700 and RCM6710 almost exactly
matches my wish list. The price is right in my budget ($35 base / $45 with
Ethernet). The availability at Digikey and Mouse look good (100 to 200 units
per month).
Actually, the only thing that has me worried is this discussion group. It used
to host traffic in the 500 to 700 messages per month range. Now it's in
the 10 per month range. What happened? Are you guys abandoning the Rabbit
platform for another?
Sorry for being so verbose... I have a hard time restraining myself to short
messages. I'm not a child of the text messaging age, more like the
inter-office paper memo age...
Matthew T. Linehan
American LED-gible Engineering
www.ledgible.com
www.ledandon.com
Is it advisable to use the RCM6700 in new designs?
Started by ●January 26, 2015
Reply by ●January 26, 20152015-01-26
You will probably get as many opinions as there are members of this group on
whether to use the RCM67xx modules in new designs. My opinion is that you should
use them if they meet your requirements. My company continues to use RCM2000
modules that were designed into our products in 2001. For new products today on
one of our product lines, we use the RCM6750.
There is probably no one reason for the drop-off in group traffic. But I suspect a big factor is the company that bought Z-World/Rabbit Semi a few years ago, Digi (digi.com). Since then, there appears to be much less advertising of the Rabbit, Rabbit products are not always easy to find on the Digi website, and the Rabbit products are no longer present at embedded trade shows.
In addition, the limited memory available on Rabbit modules has forced many to move to different platforms. The 2000 and 3000 series are fixed at 512k max of program space. I have many projects where the program memory is full and I can no longer add new features without removing some other feature. In a number of those cases we have moved to the RCM6700 line, because it has double the memory space. But eventually it too will fill up, and there have been no new Rabbit products released since the buyout. There also have been no upgrades, or improvements to the development suite. I don't know what's going on at Digi with the Rabbit product line, but I've seen no evidence to indicate they are doing anything with it other than selling the current products.
So I see it as a combination of no new users along with existing users moving to other products as to why the traffic on this group is down.
Steve
There is probably no one reason for the drop-off in group traffic. But I suspect a big factor is the company that bought Z-World/Rabbit Semi a few years ago, Digi (digi.com). Since then, there appears to be much less advertising of the Rabbit, Rabbit products are not always easy to find on the Digi website, and the Rabbit products are no longer present at embedded trade shows.
In addition, the limited memory available on Rabbit modules has forced many to move to different platforms. The 2000 and 3000 series are fixed at 512k max of program space. I have many projects where the program memory is full and I can no longer add new features without removing some other feature. In a number of those cases we have moved to the RCM6700 line, because it has double the memory space. But eventually it too will fill up, and there have been no new Rabbit products released since the buyout. There also have been no upgrades, or improvements to the development suite. I don't know what's going on at Digi with the Rabbit product line, but I've seen no evidence to indicate they are doing anything with it other than selling the current products.
So I see it as a combination of no new users along with existing users moving to other products as to why the traffic on this group is down.
Steve
Reply by ●January 27, 20152015-01-27
Can anyone suggest alternatives to the RCM6710 module. I'm planning on
using uCos for my RTOS. My gut tells me that using Linux or any form of Windows
is a bad idea. Probably not surprising since I'm most comfortable coding
old fashioned C with tiny bits of assembly as needed on bare metal 8 bit
micro-controllers.
I have asked Digi to characterize their plans for the RCM67xx, I asked if they view the modules as acceptable for new designs, and if they expect them to be available until about 2025.
I have asked Digi to characterize their plans for the RCM67xx, I asked if they view the modules as acceptable for new designs, and if they expect them to be available until about 2025.
Reply by ●January 27, 20152015-01-27
I agree with your gut. Check this out:
NANO54415 Embedded Ethernet Core Module http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415
http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415
NANO54415 Embedded Ethernet Core Module http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415 NANO54415 Price Part Number Description Qty. 1 Qty. 100 Qty. 1000 � NANO54415-200IR Ethernet Core Module $79 $69 $59 Buy Now! NANO-BOB-200...
View on www.netburner.com http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415
Preview by Yahoo
Steve
NANO54415 Embedded Ethernet Core Module http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415
http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415
NANO54415 Embedded Ethernet Core Module http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415 NANO54415 Price Part Number Description Qty. 1 Qty. 100 Qty. 1000 � NANO54415-200IR Ethernet Core Module $79 $69 $59 Buy Now! NANO-BOB-200...
View on www.netburner.com http://www.netburner.com/products/core-modules/nano54415
Preview by Yahoo
Steve
Reply by ●January 27, 20152015-01-27
Hello Mathew,
I started using Netburner “Nano” modules several years ago. They supply a real compiler, RTOS, and these boards are much faster than the Rabbit Boards. The compiler tools use the Eclipse IDE, their examples are excellent, and support both C++ and C. There are also related companies that sell LCD displays, and other hardware for these boards (Versamodule).
Rich
From: r... [mailto:r...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 11:17 AM
To: r...
Subject: [rabbit-semi] Re: Is it advisable to use the RCM6700 in new designs?
Can anyone suggest alternatives to the RCM6710 module. I'm planning on using uCos for my RTOS. My gut tells me that using Linux or any form of Windows is a bad idea. Probably not surprising since I'm most comfortable coding old fashioned C with tiny bits of assembly as needed on bare metal 8 bit micro-controllers.
I have asked Digi to characterize their plans for the RCM67xx, I asked if they view the modules as acceptable for new designs, and if they expect them to be available until about 2025.
I started using Netburner “Nano” modules several years ago. They supply a real compiler, RTOS, and these boards are much faster than the Rabbit Boards. The compiler tools use the Eclipse IDE, their examples are excellent, and support both C++ and C. There are also related companies that sell LCD displays, and other hardware for these boards (Versamodule).
Rich
From: r... [mailto:r...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 11:17 AM
To: r...
Subject: [rabbit-semi] Re: Is it advisable to use the RCM6700 in new designs?
Can anyone suggest alternatives to the RCM6710 module. I'm planning on using uCos for my RTOS. My gut tells me that using Linux or any form of Windows is a bad idea. Probably not surprising since I'm most comfortable coding old fashioned C with tiny bits of assembly as needed on bare metal 8 bit micro-controllers.
I have asked Digi to characterize their plans for the RCM67xx, I asked if they view the modules as acceptable for new designs, and if they expect them to be available until about 2025.
Reply by ●January 27, 20152015-01-27
On 1/27/2015 2:55 PM, 'Richard Wayman' r...@rfsystems.net
[rabbit-semi] wrote:
>
> Hello Mathew,
>
>
>
> I started using Netburner “Nano” modules several years ago. They
> supply a real compiler, RTOS, and these boards are much faster than
> the Rabbit Boards. The compiler tools use the Eclipse IDE, their
> examples are excellent, and support both C++ and C. There are also
> related companies that sell LCD displays, and other hardware for these
> boards (Versamodule).
>
>
>
I used their older modules on a design years ago. Worked well. My only
complaint was the yearly fee for the IDE (not bad though.)
The new module looks good
I have also used the PIC32MX CPU's in a current design. Once going they
are nice but the IDE was a pain to set up. They don't have BBRAM though
but I would use a SD card or external RAM/Flash. This design replaced an
RCM2200. An order of magnitude more speed and 1/5th the cost.
Would also look at ARM, but the dev tools and licensing got expensive
when i looked a few years ago.
The Rasberry Pi, Beagle Bone boards look good aslo. You can't beat the
prie/performance of the Pi module, just wish it had better I/O.
--
------
Scott G. Henion, Consultant
Web site: http://SHDesigns.org
------
[rabbit-semi] wrote:
>
> Hello Mathew,
>
>
>
> I started using Netburner “Nano” modules several years ago. They
> supply a real compiler, RTOS, and these boards are much faster than
> the Rabbit Boards. The compiler tools use the Eclipse IDE, their
> examples are excellent, and support both C++ and C. There are also
> related companies that sell LCD displays, and other hardware for these
> boards (Versamodule).
>
>
>
I used their older modules on a design years ago. Worked well. My only
complaint was the yearly fee for the IDE (not bad though.)
The new module looks good
I have also used the PIC32MX CPU's in a current design. Once going they
are nice but the IDE was a pain to set up. They don't have BBRAM though
but I would use a SD card or external RAM/Flash. This design replaced an
RCM2200. An order of magnitude more speed and 1/5th the cost.
Would also look at ARM, but the dev tools and licensing got expensive
when i looked a few years ago.
The Rasberry Pi, Beagle Bone boards look good aslo. You can't beat the
prie/performance of the Pi module, just wish it had better I/O.
--
------
Scott G. Henion, Consultant
Web site: http://SHDesigns.org
------
Reply by ●January 27, 20152015-01-27
Mattew
We investigated the RCM6710 and like the earlier products it has a lot going for it.
A main factor for us was the need for a Professional Dev Tool Set, we used Softools on the RCM 3700, it’s features and support were brilliant.
But I believe the lack of support from Digi for Third Party tools means the Softools move to the 6000 processor is commercially difficult.
Many of us live in hope that Softools 6000 may one day arrive, but without if we have abandoned the RCM6XXX series
Plus there is also the fact that you were looking for 10 year production.
The line our supplier fed us was: “We would receive ample notification should any products become discontinued, none were planned at this time”, so fasten your seatbelts with that one.
Have a look at http://www.embeddedarm.com/products/board-detail.php?product=TS-4600
Yes it is twice the price, more than twice the size but it has a long term production and at USD 99 is good value for the features.
We have found their support to be excellent, even for unintentional stupid questions.
I also find that young engineers from Uni have linux experience in their training and can contribute earlier in their employment.
I perceive the old days of metal bashing are declining, irrespective of how much fun it is and has been.
There is also the Pi and others, our concern is that these were established as training products to grow the market of future engineers and hence technology industry.
We do not perceive them as commercial ten year platforms and may well morph a number of times in that period.
Regards
Graham Dollin
Production Software Limited
Mb +64 272843339
From: m...@yahoo.com [rabbit-semi] [mailto:r...]
Sent: Wednesday, 28 January 2015 8:17 a.m.
To: r...
Subject: [rabbit-semi] Re: Is it advisable to use the RCM6700 in new designs?
Can anyone suggest alternatives to the RCM6710 module. I'm planning on using uCos for my RTOS. My gut tells me that using Linux or any form of Windows is a bad idea. Probably not surprising since I'm most comfortable coding old fashioned C with tiny bits of assembly as needed on bare metal 8 bit micro-controllers.
I have asked Digi to characterize their plans for the RCM67xx, I asked if they view the modules as acceptable for new designs, and if they expect them to be available until about 2025.
We investigated the RCM6710 and like the earlier products it has a lot going for it.
A main factor for us was the need for a Professional Dev Tool Set, we used Softools on the RCM 3700, it’s features and support were brilliant.
But I believe the lack of support from Digi for Third Party tools means the Softools move to the 6000 processor is commercially difficult.
Many of us live in hope that Softools 6000 may one day arrive, but without if we have abandoned the RCM6XXX series
Plus there is also the fact that you were looking for 10 year production.
The line our supplier fed us was: “We would receive ample notification should any products become discontinued, none were planned at this time”, so fasten your seatbelts with that one.
Have a look at http://www.embeddedarm.com/products/board-detail.php?product=TS-4600
Yes it is twice the price, more than twice the size but it has a long term production and at USD 99 is good value for the features.
We have found their support to be excellent, even for unintentional stupid questions.
I also find that young engineers from Uni have linux experience in their training and can contribute earlier in their employment.
I perceive the old days of metal bashing are declining, irrespective of how much fun it is and has been.
There is also the Pi and others, our concern is that these were established as training products to grow the market of future engineers and hence technology industry.
We do not perceive them as commercial ten year platforms and may well morph a number of times in that period.
Regards
Graham Dollin
Production Software Limited
Mb +64 272843339
From: m...@yahoo.com [rabbit-semi] [mailto:r...]
Sent: Wednesday, 28 January 2015 8:17 a.m.
To: r...
Subject: [rabbit-semi] Re: Is it advisable to use the RCM6700 in new designs?
Can anyone suggest alternatives to the RCM6710 module. I'm planning on using uCos for my RTOS. My gut tells me that using Linux or any form of Windows is a bad idea. Probably not surprising since I'm most comfortable coding old fashioned C with tiny bits of assembly as needed on bare metal 8 bit micro-controllers.
I have asked Digi to characterize their plans for the RCM67xx, I asked if they view the modules as acceptable for new designs, and if they expect them to be available until about 2025.
Reply by ●January 27, 20152015-01-27
On Jan 27, 2015, at 1:47 PM, Graham Dollin g...@prodsoft.co.nz [rabbit-semi]
wrote:
> There is also the Pi and others, our concern is that these were established as training products to grow the market of future engineers and hence technology industry.
>
> We do not perceive them as commercial ten year platforms and may well morph a number of times in that period.
>
I had the same thoughts as Graham regarding the Pi and BeagleBone platforms. It seems that both are more of a "proof of concept" or hobbyist platform good for one-off or short-term production runs. I would be extremely surprised if five years from now (let alone 10) I can buy a BeagleBone Black or Raspberry Pi that is firmware compatible with the ones sold today.
Then again, with embedded Linux development maybe those platforms can morph in that time frame and still work just as well as an embedded board that remains unchanged. My Magic 8-Ball is having trouble figuring that one out.
-Tom
> There is also the Pi and others, our concern is that these were established as training products to grow the market of future engineers and hence technology industry.
>
> We do not perceive them as commercial ten year platforms and may well morph a number of times in that period.
>
I had the same thoughts as Graham regarding the Pi and BeagleBone platforms. It seems that both are more of a "proof of concept" or hobbyist platform good for one-off or short-term production runs. I would be extremely surprised if five years from now (let alone 10) I can buy a BeagleBone Black or Raspberry Pi that is firmware compatible with the ones sold today.
Then again, with embedded Linux development maybe those platforms can morph in that time frame and still work just as well as an embedded board that remains unchanged. My Magic 8-Ball is having trouble figuring that one out.
-Tom
Reply by ●January 29, 20152015-01-29
Thanks everyone for your input. I really like the Netburner Nano, but I
don't think I can stretch my budget that far...
Question: Would anyone be interested in a variant of the Netburner Nano, with all the same electronics, but on a lower cost square (say approx. 2.5" by 2.5") 0.063" FR4 PCB instead of the PCIe form Factor? The board edge gold fingers would be replaced with low cost pin headers along two sides.
Matt
Question: Would anyone be interested in a variant of the Netburner Nano, with all the same electronics, but on a lower cost square (say approx. 2.5" by 2.5") 0.063" FR4 PCB instead of the PCIe form Factor? The board edge gold fingers would be replaced with low cost pin headers along two sides.
Matt
Reply by ●February 3, 20152015-02-03
Well I got my Rabbit RCM6710 standard development kit today... I also have a
Netburner Nano development kit on the way...
and just for fun, I ordered a $20 Texas Instruments Tiva C Series TM4C1294 launchpad board...
Let the battles begin! If anyone is interested, I'll post my comparative experience.
Matt
and just for fun, I ordered a $20 Texas Instruments Tiva C Series TM4C1294 launchpad board...
Let the battles begin! If anyone is interested, I'll post my comparative experience.
Matt
