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At 12:54 AM 2/12/2005, Michael Johnson wrote:
>The MacGraigor software is a free download from
their website. It can't >be that difficult to connect up flash programming to it..... Last I talked to them, the programming SW is $500.... >We now supply a standalone loader with our product so that licenced >customers can do programming without having to buy a full user licence >to our 495 IDE+Compiler+C Library+Debugger+RTOS package. Ah yes, you were the one mentioning that some people are buying your IDE to just use the programming SW :-) >Michael > > > The problem is not so much the JTAG dongle. Even the official Wiggler is > > "only" $150 or so, but the programming SW. I went to high and low to > > try to > > convince some 3rd party that there are much money to be made in the low > > cost market, especially once we start shipping our compiler. We tried 3 > > companies before we found one. Someone at Rowley even said that some > > people > > buy their $1000 IDE just to access their flash downloader. > > > > So yea, it would be interesting to see how the market plays out in the > > next > > year... > > // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, please use richard at imagecraft.com) |
SAM7 vs TMS470 vs IP2K
Started by ●February 10, 2005
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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Basically as the subject states, I'm interested in hearing if it is possible to use the olimex ARM-JTAG (http://www.olimex.com/dev/arm-jtag.html and USD$20) with the at91sam7 series. Thanks Nigel -- |
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Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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Yes it is possible - see www.rowley.co.uk Regards Michael > Basically as the subject states, I'm interested in hearing if it is > possible to use the olimex ARM-JTAG > (http://www.olimex.com/dev/arm-jtag.html and USD$20) with the at91sam7 > series. > > Thanks > Nigel > -- > > * > > *>. |
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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MacCraigor have a DL including the free GCC tool chain and an app OcdRemote. OcdRemote seems to be a free download too. http://www.macraigor.com/gnu_faq.htm#why_free So I think this is what is being referred to when "MacCraigor SW is free" Even on their software page they split it up into "products" and "free software" So are all wigglers the same (is the olimex as good as the original)? And does ARM enjoy the same level of open source software support as AVR? ie all the needed elements of the tool chain can be found? And finally, what is the current, cheapest ARM7 core that beginners are using and is available? SAM7s start availablility around April right? Wow. that is a lot of questions, Nigel Richard wrote: > At 12:54 AM 2/12/2005, Michael Johnson wrote: > >The MacGraigor software is a free download from their website. It can't > >be that difficult to connect up flash programming to it..... > > Last I talked to them, the programming SW is $500.... > > >We now supply a standalone loader with our product so that licenced > >customers can do programming without having to buy a full user licence > >to our 495 IDE+Compiler+C Library+Debugger+RTOS package. > > Ah yes, you were the one mentioning that some people are buying your > IDE to > just use the programming SW :-) > >Michael > > > > > The problem is not so much the JTAG dongle. Even the official > Wiggler is > > > "only" $150 or so, but the programming SW. I went to high and low to > > > try to > > > convince some 3rd party that there are much money to be made in > the low > > > cost market, especially once we start shipping our compiler. We > tried 3 > > > companies before we found one. Someone at Rowley even said that some > > > people > > > buy their $1000 IDE just to access their flash downloader. > > > > > > So yea, it would be interesting to see how the market plays out in the > > > next > > > year... > > > > > // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, please > use richard at imagecraft.com) > * > > *>. > > -- |
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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I have to admit that I am not completly familiar with all the pieces, but you can get most, if not all, of what you need from the GNU tool chain at www.gnuarm.com. The GNU tools support a debugger, but that does not necessarily mean it includes a flash programmer. But each ARM MCU maker should provide info and/or software on how to program their ARMs. Many of them support downloading via a bootloader and a serial port. Have you checked the app notes on the Atmel site? If there is something that needs to be made more available, you can upload it here. --- In , MrMicro <MrMicro@g...> wrote: > MacCraigor have a DL including the free GCC tool chain and an app > OcdRemote. OcdRemote seems to be a free download too. > http://www.macraigor.com/gnu_faq.htm#why_free > > So I think this is what is being referred to when "MacCraigor SW is free" > > Even on their software page they split it up into "products" and "free > software" > > So are all wigglers the same (is the olimex as good as the original)? > And does ARM enjoy the same level of open source software support as > AVR? ie all the needed elements of the tool chain can be found? > > And finally, what is the current, cheapest ARM7 core that beginners are > using and is available? > > SAM7s start availablility around April right? > > Wow. that is a lot of questions, |
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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GNU does not include a flash downloader, ASAP. Philips and Atmel both have
bootloader flash download, probably other ARM MCU would have them too, if they are smart. Of course if they are really smart, they should give out their flash algorithms to 3rd party so proper support can be done. At 07:47 AM 2/12/2005, Rick Collins wrote: >I have to admit that I am not completly familiar with all the pieces, >but you can get most, if not all, of what you need from the GNU tool >chain at www.gnuarm.com. > >The GNU tools support a debugger, but that does not necessarily mean >it includes a flash programmer. But each ARM MCU maker should provide >info and/or software on how to program their ARMs. Many of them >support downloading via a bootloader and a serial port. > >Have you checked the app notes on the Atmel site? If there is >something that needs to be made more available, you can upload it >here. // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, please use richard at imagecraft.com) |
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Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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At 01:43 PM 2/12/05 -0800, Richard wrote: >GNU does not include a flash downloader, ASAP. Philips and Atmel both have >bootloader flash download, probably other ARM MCU would have them too, if >they are smart. ASAP? Philips and Analog Devices both have documented bootloader support and command line programs (and GUI as well) for serial downloading. I haven't seen any documentation for Atmel's bootloader yet only a vague reference to it using a xmodem protocol. ST promised serial ISP support but has since apparently abandoned it. That covers the small ARMs I'm aware of (ie less than 80 pins) Robert " 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself. There are always restrictions, be they legal, genetic, or physical. If you don't believe me, try to chew a radio signal. " Kelvin Throop, III |
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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Oops. I meant AFAIK, that should teach me on showing keystrokes :-).... Anyhow, the bootloader thing is great from the MCU manufacturers point of view, because they can tell their customers, "see - you can program our parts with zero cost!!" From a 3rd party vendor such as myself, it's much easy if they publish their flash algorithms so we can support all the devices the same way. Our flash downloader/JTAG dongle does support the SAM7, by the way. It's going to be priced around $175. In the ideal case, we would fold it into our compiler IDE, but then we really wouldn't be making any money :-) It's not a dig at competitors per se, but to mention that it is our philosophy - we are one of the few new ARM vendors that write our own compilers. Even Keil starts with GNU (they are now moving to their own code generator...) At 01:58 PM 2/12/2005, Robert Adsett wrote: >At 01:43 PM 2/12/05 -0800, Richard wrote: > >GNU does not include a flash downloader, ASAP. Philips and Atmel both have > >bootloader flash download, probably other ARM MCU would have them too, if > >they are smart. > >ASAP? > >Philips and Analog Devices both have documented bootloader support and >command line programs (and GUI as well) for serial downloading. I haven't >seen any documentation for Atmel's bootloader yet only a vague reference to >it using a xmodem protocol. ST promised serial ISP support but has since >apparently abandoned it. > >That covers the small ARMs I'm aware of (ie less than 80 pins) > >Robert > >" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself. There are always restrictions, >be they legal, genetic, or physical. If you don't believe me, try to >chew a radio signal. " > > Kelvin Throop, III > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, please use richard at imagecraft.com) |
Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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I think that was true of the AVR in early days as well, programmers AND software were a bit scare then the are now, but hopefully the ARM's popularity will fix that in short order. ARM SAM vs Mega 128... no question which I want to use :-). For comments on the Motorola stuff...er, Frescale, I love the motorola automotive lineup, but they generally suck when it comes to getting things out to the public (i.e., not the OEM's), I have been messing with the 332/336 for years, but the parts are still expensive, not to mention the cost for a MPC555x part (then fingure out how to mount the BGA!). I downloaded a couple of the GCC based packes (Rowley's, GNUARM, etc) and I think 2 reason would cause me to buy software for arm devel, that one is the Flash loader software, and the second is non-GCC compiler. I use the Codevision for the AVR, and will look at Richards (imagecraft's) when I get a chance. My needs are more hackish then other's I'm guessing, so pricing entry is important and GCC in general is not my friend except it is free! (I use it most every day at work). Rowley's looked nice, but for me the cost may be a bit high, and I think the ARM sanctioned maintainer of GCC has some good stuff coming soon for optimizations, etc. FYI - I pulled a download of Borland's C++BuilderX which is basically a cross platform IDE (NOT A GUI DESIGN TOOL) that can host several compilers, including GCC, Symian O/S, built in debug, etc. Free for personal version, but you can, as it seems change the compiler from g++/gcc to what ever you need. Nice environment, code clean/refactor, etc. Much like ECLIPSE, both are java based and free. (Eclipse has C/C++ plugs but not very mature as last check), but you generally get what you pay for (plug for commercial verdors out here). Back to the questions, does anyone have dev boards with the SAM-a3 processor? I have not been lucky in finding one as yet. Good list so far! Sandy --- In , MrMicro <MrMicro@g...> wrote: > "I like the ATMEL AVR popularity and that is also a big factor in the > SAM series for me hoping the ARM stuff gets the same reception!" > > I'm an AVR user hoping to add SAM7 ARM to my tool kit soon. I think the > only thing stopping the > SAM7 being as, or more popular than the AVR is the cost of a programmer > (hunderds not tens of dollars). > I've been in contact with a few AVR programmer sellers and serveral of > them emailed me back saying they were working on some cheap ARMs > programmers (less than $100, hopefully less than $30) and they hope to > release these in the first half of this year. > > If this happens a lot of people will suddenly be able to flood into the > ARM community and I think the SAM7 will enjoy the support and community > as the AVR currently does. > > Here is hoping, > Nigel > Sandy wrote: > > > > > Just saw the TI parts yesterday as well as their nice board with JTAG > > ($399). I have the same question SAMA3 vs the similar TI 470 parts. I > > am looking at what ever will be easier to get! > > > > I like the ATMEL AVR popularity and that is also a big factor in the > > SAM series for me hoping the ARM stuff gets the same reception! > > > > BTW I am very new the the ARM stuff, and will likely use it for an > > automotive app to replace an aged, unfinished design with the MC68336 > > part. > > > > Any SAM7-A3 Dev boards out yet? > > > > Lastly does anyone have PROTEL libs for any of the SAM parts? > > > > Thanks > > > > Sandy > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , "Tony Ambrosini" <tambrosini77@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Has anyone here ever come across the new ARM micros that TI came > > out > > > with (supposedly)? Does anyone know how real the TI parts are? If > > > they are, what makes the SAM7 better? I have been having trouble > > > finding comparison data. > > > > > > Also, I have heard of people using this IP2000 chip from Ubicom. It > > > is RISC-based like an MSP430 from TI, but has two SerDes and a > > > MAC+PHY. Any rumblings about Atmel adding these features in the > > > SAM7X family? > > > > > > Thank you! Any information would be most helpful. > > > > > > > > > > * > > > > > > > > *>. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > |
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Reply by ●February 12, 20052005-02-12
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Not from an Auto company, so out of luck on the Freescale parts. The Nice thing about the ARM stuff is that it is so fast that most of the complex hardware can be removed, the TPU in the automotive parts is crazy complex, but if you can get it working, you can save many cpu cycles, but now you have much more of them 'cycles' you can do it in software as few have with the AVR processors. The SAM-A3 looks good for me! Thanks Sandy --- In , "Anton Erasmus" <antone@s...> wrote: > On 11 Feb 2005 at 19:44, Sandy wrote: > > > > > > > Just saw the TI parts yesterday as well as their nice board with JTAG > > ($399). I have the same question SAMA3 vs the similar TI 470 parts. I > > am looking at what ever will be easier to get! > > > > I like the ATMEL AVR popularity and that is also a big factor in the > > SAM series for me hoping the ARM stuff gets the same reception! > > > > BTW I am very new the the ARM stuff, and will likely use it for an > > automotive app to replace an aged, unfinished design with the MC68336 > > part. > > If you are from one of the bigger automotive companies, then you can > use the Freescale ARMs. They have similar peripherals as the older M68K > and coldfire MCUs. > > Regards > Anton Erasmus > -- > A J Erasmus |
