Advice neede: Atmel or Philips ARM

Hi Gurus,

I am switching from AVR to ARM. Currently, I use an ATmega162 which is
running out of code space (16kB) and performance. But I find it difficult to
choose between Atmel's ARM (looking at the SAM7S series) and thePhilips
LPC2104/5/6 series. I don't need many peripherals (yet). My current design
uses an FTDI chip for USB, I could save that by using Atmel (Philips has no
USB), but on the other hand, that makes me responsible for all the PC/Mac
drivers as well. Ethernet might be interesting later (currently using
XPort).
Thinking about each option pops up 10 new questions. Like for ethernet: I'd
like to send serial data to multiple hosts. UDP broadcasts or multiple
TCP/IP connections. In the latter case: how much resources will that cost?

Questions, questions, questions......

Any answers/tips/hints anyone?

Meindert

Meindert Sprang wrote:
> Hi Gurus,
> 
> I am switching from AVR to ARM. Currently, I use an ATmega162 which is
> running out of code space (16kB) and performance. But I find it difficult to
> choose between Atmel's ARM (looking at the SAM7S series) and thePhilips
> LPC2104/5/6 series. I don't need many peripherals (yet). My current design
> uses an FTDI chip for USB, I could save that by using Atmel (Philips has no
> USB), but on the other hand, that makes me responsible for all the PC/Mac
> drivers as well. Ethernet might be interesting later (currently using
> XPort).

I've chosen Atmel:
- USB (available in Philips 214x series)
- easy code download via UART or USB
- easy interfacing to 5V
- not too many known errors (Philips errata is huuuge)
- nice feature of set/reset registers in peripherals

"Meindert Sprang" <ms@NOJUNKcustomORSPAMware.nl> wrote in message
news:1222cdc5vogkg67@corp.supernews.com...
> Hi Gurus,
>
> I am switching from AVR to ARM. Currently, I use an ATmega162 which is
> running out of code space (16kB) and performance. But I find it difficult
to
> choose between Atmel's ARM (looking at the SAM7S series) and thePhilips
> LPC2104/5/6 series. I don't need many peripherals (yet). My current design
> uses an FTDI chip for USB, I could save that by using Atmel (Philips has
no
> USB), but on the other hand, that makes me responsible for all the PC/Mac
> drivers as well. Ethernet might be interesting later (currently using
> XPort).
> Thinking about each option pops up 10 new questions. Like for ethernet:
I'd
> like to send serial data to multiple hosts. UDP broadcasts or multiple
> TCP/IP connections. In the latter case: how much resources will that cost?
>
> Questions, questions, questions......
>
> Any answers/tips/hints anyone?
>
> Meindert
>
>


I've chosen the Atmel (SAM7 series) so far - one big project completed and
annother well under way. I'm using the Keil (now owned by ARM) tools.
I've had very few problems (well none really).
The ADC system is pretty good in terms of ease of control (obviously its not
the ultimate in actual converter technology) but the IO is fairly slow for
bit banging despite the set/reset registers.
Atmel do offer some help with USB drivers but its nothing like as complete
as FTDI.
I think the Keil tools have some Ethernet support but I have not used it.

Michael Kellett

www.mkesc.co.uk

the bit bang PIO is extremly slow in SAM !!
to my surprise 48MHz SAM is slower with bitbang than AVR @8MHz

Antti

> I am switching from AVR to ARM. Currently, I use an ATmega162 which is
> running out of code space (16kB) and performance. But I find it difficult 
> to
> choose between Atmel's ARM (looking at the SAM7S series) and thePhilips
> LPC2104/5/6 series. I don't need many peripherals (yet). My current design
> uses an FTDI chip for USB, I could save that by using Atmel (Philips has 
> no
> USB), but on the other hand, that makes me responsible for all the PC/Mac
> drivers as well. Ethernet might be interesting later (currently using
> XPort).

Also you can use the Mass Storage, HID and CDC drivers (UART) already 
present in Windows.
The CDC in Windows is not optimal, but you can get source code of the 
6124.sys
used for flashing the part...

> Thinking about each option pops up 10 new questions. Like for ethernet: 
> I'd
> like to send serial data to multiple hosts. UDP broadcasts or multiple
> TCP/IP connections. In the latter case: how much resources will that cost?
>
> Questions, questions, questions......
>
> Any answers/tips/hints anyone?
>
> Meindert
>



-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
This is intended to be my personal opinion which may,
or may bot be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB 

"Antti" <Antti.Lukats@xilant.com> skrev i meddelandet 
news:1143036074.221654.78130@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> the bit bang PIO is extremly slow in SAM !!
> to my surprise 48MHz SAM is slower with bitbang than AVR @8MHz
>
> Antti
>
The toggle rate is 5-6 MHz.

If you can use the high speed peripherals like the SPI, then the clock is up 
to 48 Mhz.
Unfortunately, there is a limitation on the I/O buffers, so the practical 
limit is really around 30 Mhz.
If you run the USB and thus the core at 48 MHz,the SPI should run at 24 Mhz.
SSC would then run at 12 Mhz.
USART 24 MHz sync mode and 3 Mbps Async mode.
The internal PDC will make it a piece of cake sustaining this transfer rate.

When new I/O buffers are introduced, this limitation will go away and the 48 
MHz will be available.

For a real fast toggle rate, the internal 160 kB SRAM of the AT91SAM9261 
will allow
running 180 MHz zero waitstate from a 64 kB area.
The SAM9261 first production batch is in the fab, and it should be possible 
to get samples.
It does not have any internal flash, and you need to boot from a small 
external SPI Flash.

-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
This is intended to be my personal opinion which may,
or may bot be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB 

In article <1222cdc5vogkg67@corp.supernews.com>, Meindert Sprang
<ms@NOJUNKcustomORSPAMware.nl> writes
>Hi Gurus,
>
>I am switching from AVR to ARM. Currently, I use an ATmega162 which is
>running out of code space (16kB) and performance. But I find it difficult to
>choose between Atmel's ARM (looking at the SAM7S series) and thePhilips
>LPC2104/5/6 series. I don't need many peripherals (yet). My current design
>uses an FTDI chip for USB, I could save that by using Atmel (Philips has no
>USB), but on the other hand, that makes me responsible for all the PC/Mac
>drivers as well. Ethernet might be interesting later (currently using
>XPort).
>Thinking about each option pops up 10 new questions. Like for ethernet: I'd
>like to send serial data to multiple hosts. UDP broadcasts or multiple
>TCP/IP connections. In the latter case: how much resources will that cost?
>
>Questions, questions, questions......
>
>Any answers/tips/hints anyone?
>
>Meindert

Philips will have USB "soon" 

The only other comment is that the in Atmel the ARM parts are part of
the FGPA/ASIC/memories division and not the micros division. SO it may
be like dealing with a completely different company. 

Atmel have ARM7 and 9 now. 

On the other hand there is the AVR32....  This must be available as I
have seen a compiler for it (it's on my other pc). so you could stay
with the AVR family. 


 

-- 
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills  Staffs  England     /\/\/\/\/
/\/\/ chris@phaedsys.org      www.phaedsys.org \/\/\
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

> I am switching from AVR to ARM. Currently, I use an ATmega162 which is
> running out of code space (16kB) and performance.

If you just need a chip with dual UART, the ATmega324P which is a 44/44 pin 
package will have dual UART
and will be cheaper than the mega64.
While I have devices in my hand, it is not generally sampling yet (expect 
that to happen in mid this year).
It is mega16 pin compatible and not mega162 pin compatible.
It will run 10/20 MHz instead of 8/16 Mhz so it is 25% faster.

> But I find it difficult to
> choose between Atmel's ARM (looking at the SAM7S series) and thePhilips
> LPC2104/5/6 series. I don't need many peripherals (yet). My current design
> uses an FTDI chip for USB, I could save that by using Atmel (Philips has 
> no
> USB), but on the other hand, that makes me responsible for all the PC/Mac
> drivers as well. Ethernet might be interesting later (currently using
> XPort).
> Thinking about each option pops up 10 new questions. Like for ethernet: 
> I'd
> like to send serial data to multiple hosts. UDP broadcasts or multiple
> TCP/IP connections. In the latter case: how much resources will that cost?
>
> Questions, questions, questions......
>
> Any answers/tips/hints anyone?
>
> Meindert
>


-- 
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
This is intended to be my personal opinion which may,
or may bot be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB 

Chris Hills wrote:

> On the other hand there is the AVR32....  This must be available as I
> have seen a compiler for it (it's on my other pc). so you could stay
> with the AVR family. 

AVR32 looks to me like Atmel's own variation of ARM theme.

Antti wrote:

> the bit bang PIO is extremly slow in SAM !!
> to my surprise 48MHz SAM is slower with bitbang than AVR @8MHz

  No real surprise, that's why Philips added their own faster IO scheme,
and others are following.
  How much bit-io is done ? - one could always add a slave device like
a AT89LP2052 / LP216, if you want custom bit-io ?
  Or how about use BOTH, take the 2101 for fastIO, and Slave it to
a bigger 91SAM :)
  ST have some ARM9 with Flash comming...
-jg