Simple Still Camera components?

Greetings,
  I am trying to design and implement a very simple camera that would
capture VGA quality images and store them to  flash memory such as SD
or MMC.
  I am seeking the advice of the experienced people out there about
the recommendations for a microcontroller and image sensor
combination.  I am looking for a fairly low cost solution since it is
only a hobby.  I know that I can get a cheap camera and all, but I
would like to learn about it and try to implement it myself.

Thank you for your time and help.

-- A

amerdsp wrote:

> Greetings,
>   I am trying to design and implement a very simple camera that would
> capture VGA quality images and store them to  flash memory such as SD
> or MMC.
>   I am seeking the advice of the experienced people out there about
> the recommendations for a microcontroller and image sensor
> combination.  I am looking for a fairly low cost solution since it is
> only a hobby.  I know that I can get a cheap camera and all, but I
> would like to learn about it and try to implement it myself.
> 
> Thank you for your time and help.
> 

Take 4164 in ceramic package. Carefully open the cover so the crystal is 
exposed. Project a light image to the crystal. Generate DRAM signals by 
a microcontroller. Fill DRAM with ones (or with zeroes - I don't 
remember). Switch off refresh for some time. Then read DRAM. You will 
get a pretty clear black and white bitmap picture.



Vladimir Vassilevsky

DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant

http://www.abvolt.com

Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:

<snip>
> 
> Take 4164 in ceramic package. Carefully open the cover so the crystal is 
> exposed. Project a light image to the crystal. Generate DRAM signals by 
> a microcontroller. Fill DRAM with ones (or with zeroes - I don't 
> remember). Switch off refresh for some time. Then read DRAM. You will 
> get a pretty clear black and white bitmap picture.
> 

<snip>

This piqued my interest so here are a few additional references from the
ClassicCMP mailing list:

> Anyone else remember the 'Optic RaM', a poor-man's image sensor.
> 
>>From what I remember they were a normal DRAM chip with a quartz lid to 
> the package (it's been suggested you could take a cerdip 4116 or 4164, 
> knock off the top and replkce it with a window). 
> 
> The idea was you focussed an image onto the chip. Stored 1's in all 
> locations, waited a bit and read out the contents. Those cells which had 
> been exposed to enough light would read out as 0's. Do it again with 
> different waiting times (note, once you've read out a pattern, you've 
> lost the charge stored in the cells, you have to start again, you can't 
> read the chip repeatedly without filling it with 1's), combine the 
> resulting bit patterns to get a sort-of grey scale image.
> 
> Disadvantages were the fact you had to capture the same image several 
> times to get that grey scale, and the fact that there was an insensitive 
> strip down the middle of the die where the address logic, etc was.
> 
> -tony
--------------------

>> Anyone else remember the 'Optic RaM', a poor-man's image sensor.
> 
> Oh yeah - the Micron IS32 OpticRAM...
> 
>> From what I remember they were a normal DRAM chip with a quartz lid to 
>> the package (it's been suggested you could take a cerdip 4116 or 4164, 
>> knock off the top and replkce it with a window). 
> 
> You can - there's a file called "kuckuck.zip" floating around that contains
> schematics and documentation (in German IIRC).
> 
> I'd love to get a few DRAMs to play with. ISTR the "kuckuck" file I mentioned
> calls for a NEC D4164 in CERDIP packaging with a gold cover - apparently you
> can put a soldering iron onto the cover then just push it off with a knife
> (it's soldered on).
> 
> -- 
> Phil.                        
--------------------

<snip>
> it mattered whose DRAMs
> you used.  Intels cells decayed pretty quickly, but the NEC parts would
> easily hold a bit for a few seconds.
> 
> Cheers,
> Chuck
---------------------

> Yes, I remember them.  Steve Ciarcia wrote a Circuit Cellar article
> about them.
> 
>> (it's been suggested you could take a cerdip 4116 or 4164,
>> knock off the top and replkce it with a window).
> 
> And indeed you could, though not all DRAMs were addressed in such
> straightforward linear fashion as the "proper" one.  I had (still have,
> I think) some Fujitsu 4116s you can do it with.
> 
> -- 
> Pete
---------------------

Here is an URL of a Russian-language page with details on this project:
http://kazus.ru/shemes/showpage/0/493/1.html

Here is an URL for the file 'kuckuck.zip':
http://www.vampyr.msk.ru/electroniks/kuckuck.zip
   -- NOTE: the other links found for this file are all dead; if this one
      expires, I can post the file.
   -- NOTE: archive contains theory, sample code and sample images -- the
      images are reminiscent of the video from the Fisher-Price Pixel 2000.

Regards,

Michael

On Jul 29, 9:46 pm, Vladimir Vassilevsky <antispam_bo...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Take 4164 in ceramic package. Carefully open the cover so the crystal is
> exposed. Project a light image to the crystal. Generate DRAM signals by
> a microcontroller. Fill DRAM with ones (or with zeroes - I don't
> remember). Switch off refresh for some time. Then read DRAM. You will
> get a pretty clear black and white bitmap picture.

Tried that once... harder than it sounds.

Due to the disabling refresh, you can't have the chip in a computer as
memory, but must build your own interface circuit.

Then you also have to play with lenses and get moderately reasonable
image projection at an appropriate power desnity onto the "active"
area of the die even for initial tests.  You can't just shine a
flashlight at it and mask off half the cells and expect to see a
difference, because the output transitor when uncovered becomes a
phototransistor - and that may at some light level go for the address
decode logic too.

On Jul 29, 10:31 pm, amerdsp <amer...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Greetings,
>   I am trying to design and implement a very simple camera that would
> capture VGA quality images and store them to  flash memory such as SD
> or MMC.
>   I am seeking the advice of the experienced people out there about
> the recommendations for a microcontroller and image sensor
> combination.  I am looking for a fairly low cost solution since it is
> only a hobby.  I know that I can get a cheap camera and all, but I
> would like to learn about it and try to implement it myself.
>
> Thank you for your time and help.

I read an article yesterday from the July 16 issue of EE Times on page
32.  It dissected four still cameras with the lowest priced one a
Vivitar at $10, yes $10 US!!!  It was only CIF format (352 x 288) but
still, that is amazing!  The Disney camera met your VGA requirement at
$49 and they expect this price to drop!

I would find one of these low priced units and use it for a front end
with USB as the interface.  You may need to use a discrete signal to
control the shutter.  This should be a lot easier than prying the lid
off of RAM chips.

On Jul 30, 9:38 am, rickman <gnu...@gmail.com> wrote:

> >   I am seeking the advice of the experienced people out there about
> > the recommendations for a microcontroller and image sensor
> > combination.  I am looking for a fairly low cost solution since it is
> > only a hobby.  I know that I can get a cheap camera and all, but I
> > would like to learn about it and try to implement it myself.
>
> I read an article yesterday from the July 16 issue of EE Times on page
> 32.  It dissected four still cameras with the lowest priced one a
> Vivitar at $10, yes $10 US!!!  It was only CIF format (352 x 288) but
> still, that is amazing!

Along those lines, the one-time-use (return to store for processing)
digital cameras are $10-$20... perhaps one could be used as a source
of parts, and do his own interface to the imager - since he said he
wanted the experience of doing it the hard way.

If I was doing that, I'd be tempted to play with a soft core processor
on an FPGA eval board, using the rest of the FPGA to do the low-level
interface state machine.  Though it may be possible to get a DSP-type
processor with fast synchronous I/O to interface directly to an
imager, and there's always the processor + FPGA/CPLD option at the
expense of having to prototype a bit more of a board.

On Mon, 30 Jul 2007 02:31:15 -0000, amerdsp <amerdsp@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>Greetings,
>  I am trying to design and implement a very simple camera that would
>capture VGA quality images and store them to  flash memory such as SD
>or MMC.
>  I am seeking the advice of the experienced people out there about
>the recommendations for a microcontroller and image sensor
>combination.  I am looking for a fairly low cost solution since it is
>only a hobby.  I know that I can get a cheap camera and all, but I
>would like to learn about it and try to implement it myself.


For a real roll-yer-own there's a bare sensor chip

http://www.electronics123.com/s.nl/it.A/id.69/.f?sc=8&category=241

Or a slightly more integrated module

http://www.electronics123.com/s.nl/it.A/id.42/.f?sc=8&category=241

And a mostly complete gizmo (async serial interface, JPEG output) 

http://www.electronics123.com/s.nl/it.A/id.2581/.f?sc=8&category=241

#include <std_disclaimer>
Just a satisfied customer. Got one of the full-up modules to package
into a "critter cam" one of these days...

On Jul 30, 10:38 am, rickman <gnu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 29, 10:31 pm, amerdsp <amer...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Greetings,
> >   I am trying to design and implement a very simple camera that would
> > capture VGA quality images and store them to  flash memory such as SD
> > or MMC.
> >   I am seeking the advice of the experienced people out there about
> > the recommendations for a microcontroller and image sensor
> > combination.  I am looking for a fairly low cost solution since it is
> > only a hobby.  I know that I can get a cheap camera and all, but I
> > would like to learn about it and try to implement it myself.
>
> > Thank you for your time and help.
>
> I read an article yesterday from the July 16 issue of EE Times on page
> 32.  It dissected four still cameras with the lowest priced one a
> Vivitar at $10, yes $10 US!!!  It was only CIF format (352 x 288) but
> still, that is amazing!  The Disney camera met your VGA requirement at
> $49 and they expect this price to drop!
>

So where do you think image compression takes place in these low cost
cameras?

On the same note, what do you think of using a PIC to do something
like this?  I read before that PIC's are not great for image
processing because the memory is not contiguous.  How about ARM, AVR?
Any takes on these?

Thanks again..
-- a

In news:1185851530.867734.167870@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com
timestamped Tue, 31 Jul 2007 03:12:10 -0000,
amerdsp <amerdsp@hotmail.com> posted:
|-------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|"On Jul 30, 10:38 am, rickman <gnu...@gmail.com> wrote:                  |
|> On Jul 29, 10:31 pm, amerdsp <amer...@hotmail.com> wrote:              |
|>                                                                        |
|> > Greetings,                                                           |
|> >   I am trying to design and implement a very simple camera that would|
|> > capture VGA quality images [..]                                      |
|[..]                                                                     |
|>                                                                        |
|>[..]  It was only CIF format (352 x 288) [..]                           |
|[..]                                                                     |
|                                                                         |
|On the same note, what do you think of using a PIC to do something       |
|like this?  I read before that PIC's are not great for image             |
|processing because the memory is not contiguous.  How about ARM, AVR?    |
|Any takes on these?                                                      |
|                                                                         |
|Thanks again..                                                           |
|-- a"                                                                    |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------------|

Neither a PIC nor AVR would be able to hold an entire VGA nor CIF
image in addressable memory at once. They could still be used for
image processing, if you are willing to work on small parts of an
image at a time, or if you can figure out a way to store enough
information for what you need to know about one portion of the image
while working on another part of the image.

Regards,
Colin Paul Gloster

On Jul 31, 8:21 am, Colin Paul Gloster <Colin_Paul_Glos...@ACM.org>
wrote:

> Neither a PIC nor AVR would be able to hold an entire VGA nor CIF
> image in addressable memory at once. They could still be used for

Take a closer look at the AVR family and ponder the mystical abilities
of an external RAM address bus. A YUV422 CIF image is 84480 bytes
(NTSC) or 101376 bytes (PAL), easily and fairly transparently mappable
into the AVR's data addressing space using a minimum of external glue
logic.

There are probably PICs with external buses too, though I wouldn't
know about them.