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Since such adamant statements were being made I just felt that I had to get my two cents in... > Linux is a joke, written by amateurs and still not able > to self install worth a darn. > These decisions are made in the marketplace - the only opinion that > matters. Software for the linux-joke runs more industry servers across the globe than M$. It is also well documented that, though Windows still controls overwhelming market share in desktop and non-network markets, there is growing numbers of those users migrating to other platforms. Take note of IBM and other large OEM/vendors selling pre- configured *nix-based systems. If the market was not making the decision, as you put it, these companies would not spend the massive amounts of cash involved in R&D and then advertising these systems. Obviously they did a thorough market analysis prior to jumping on this train. That being said, I don't think Linux is generally designed with the casual user in mind, although effort is being made toward that end. In the same vein, Mac OS X is a commercial product and though I have no personal experience with it I hear from "average users" that it is very robust and easy to use. Personally, I find that several Linux distributions require much less user-input during the install process than Windows, and the end result is much more reliable as well as usable. > Linux supports only obsolete > hardware and, because it has such a small customer base, > manufacturers don't provide drivers for newer hardware. This is just blatantly incorrect. Go to any consumer electronics store and read the boxes. > It's fashionable to hate Microsoft, no problem. But you need to > look at the competition - there isn't any. Wouldn't the trend to hate Microsoft be an indication of the marketplace making a decision rather than a "fashion statement"? PS: There is plenty of competition. And lastly, will you be installing this update for XP? http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF- 8&q=microsoft+largest+update+ever -- Patrick Griffin www.RedBinary.com |
16F88 bootloader
Started by ●August 8, 2004
Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
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> I am a babe at object/high level(other than the ancient > languages), but > are not Tcl and Python reincarnations of Java? I am trying to get a > handle on C++ and Perl, so why not add Python? As I just told my students, the languages Tcl, Python, Awk, Perl, C++, Java and a bunch of others are more-or-less in the same league in that they try to be kind to the user and rough to the machine, compared to the good (?) old C labguage. But they otherwise (syntax and semantics) very different. Within this group C++ and Java are more on the machine-friendly (and programmer-rough) side, the others (all pure interpreter languages) are definitely on the machine-rough/programmer-friendly side. Of this bunch I like Python the best, with emphasis on the 'I' part of that scentence. IMHO Tcl is a very funny languages, but not suited for anything but very small programs. Perl and Awk are (IMHO) not suited for anything (emphasis on IMHO, there are lots of people who disagree). I use Python for most (PC) programming where execution speed is not the primary objective (including the administration fo my web-based business). I use C when speed is important. Java and C++ are somewhere between those two extremes. Based on very little experience I think Java is too much hassle (compareable to Python, but without the - IMHO - lovely language) for the end user (compared to a C or C++ program compiled to native code). Wouter van Ooijen -- ------- Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: www.voti.nl consultancy, development, PICmicro products |
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Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
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> > Linux supports only obsolete > > hardware and, because it has such a small customer base, > > manufacturers don't provide drivers for newer hardware. > This is just blatantly incorrect. Go to any consumer electronics > store and read the boxes. It is not. It does support obsolete hardware, but I know for a fact (because I've tried) that a lot of manufacturers consider their driver information as proprietary, and won't release it so that an open source driver can be made. They won't make the effort to develop one as cold sales figures say it's not worth it. Wether this is due to pressure from Microsoft I don't know, but it's there. Laptop support in Linux is crap, there are VERY few models that could support any distro out of the box. Three Toshiba and one Fujitsu I've owned have ALL had some problem or other, were it ACPI support, screen, graphics card, keyboard strokes auto-repeating themselves if you didn't type at 1 wpm, or any combination of them. Each distro showed a number of problems, which had to be fixed with awkward patches and obscure instructions, often written and posted by great individuals who made the effort. Support from the distro houses is limited, just read the blurb on their box "support only given for basic and supported hardware". You may say "Microsoft doesn't give free support anymore to users anymore", but here we're talking about de-bunking Microsoft, and you will only achieve that by giving MORE than them. And better. > Wouldn't the trend to hate Microsoft be an indication of the > marketplace making a decision rather than a "fashion statement"? There is always a trend to hate the leader in ANY market, that is just a fact of life. If you're on top, everyone below is trying to get you off. The corporate server market, although juicy, it's peanuts compared to the end-user market, so unless Linux can get itself onto desktops, it may well be limited to ruling the corporate server world (which I think it will eventually, given rising sales figures). But on the desktop, at least for now, forget it. Regards, Mike |
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Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
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--- In , "Michael Puchol" <mpuchol@s...> wrote: > it's there. Laptop support in Linux is crap, there are VERY few models that > could support any distro out of the box. Three Toshiba and one Fujitsu I've > owned have ALL had some problem or other, were it ACPI support, screen, > graphics card, keyboard strokes auto-repeating themselves if you didn't type > at 1 wpm, or any combination of them. Huh? I have two laptops -- one old IBM Thinkpad that I own personally and one relatively new Compaq Evo supplied by my employer. Both work just fine with linux out of the box -- wireless networking and all. Oh, I guess I can think of one problem on my personal laptop and that is the winmodem doesn't work off the bat. I know that I *could* get it working but I don't worry about it since I haven't used a modem in several years. --Scott |
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Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
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Thanks Wouter, I am sure that your .nl has nothing to do with liking Python. :) I think the Tcl is only used as a Windows to unix interface for this CVS system. I would prefer to learn Java, but my brain has yet to grasp the subtleties. I only take exception to your opinion of Perl, it seem to fill a niche very well in what it does best, strings. I have yet to hear of anyone trying to make Microchip Version control work. Am I the trailblazer(sacrifice) on this one? Regards, Chad --- Wouter van Ooijen <> wrote: > > I am a babe at object/high level(other than the ancient > > languages), but > > are not Tcl and Python reincarnations of Java? I am trying to get > a > > handle on C++ and Perl, so why not add Python? > > As I just told my students, the languages Tcl, Python, Awk, Perl, > C++, > Java and a bunch of others are more-or-less in the same league in > that > they try to be kind to the user and rough to the machine, compared to > the good (?) old C labguage. But they otherwise (syntax and > semantics) > very different. Within this group C++ and Java are more on the > machine-friendly (and programmer-rough) side, the others (all pure > interpreter languages) are definitely on the > machine-rough/programmer-friendly side. Of this bunch I like Python > the > best, with emphasis on the 'I' part of that scentence. > > IMHO Tcl is a very funny languages, but not suited for anything but > very > small programs. Perl and Awk are (IMHO) not suited for anything > (emphasis on IMHO, there are lots of people who disagree). I use > Python > for most (PC) programming where execution speed is not the primary > objective (including the administration fo my web-based business). I > use > C when speed is important. Java and C++ are somewhere between those > two > extremes. Based on very little experience I think Java is too much > hassle (compareable to Python, but without the - IMHO - lovely > language) > for the end user (compared to a C or C++ program compiled to native > code). > > Wouter van Ooijen > > -- ------- > Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: www.voti.nl > consultancy, development, PICmicro products > ===== My software has no bugs, only undocumented features. __________________________________ |
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Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
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> I am sure that your .nl has nothing to do with liking Python. :) It just might. At university I got a course on ABC, designed by a guy at the Centre of Mathematics in Amsterdam. IIRC that is where Guido worked, or at least there was some other connection. ABC had a lot of the ideas that ended up in Python, including using indendation for nesting. I am still not sure whether I love or hate that feature. (Hate is more common when writing code, love when reading. Reading is more important than writing, so ...) Wouter van Ooijen -- ------- Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: www.voti.nl consultancy, development, PICmicro products |
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Reply by ●September 5, 20042004-09-05
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Same here. My Dell Latitude runs Knoppix and Mandrake with no problems whatsoever. HardDrake auto-detects all my hardware, including sound and graphics. I don't use a dial up modem on this computer, so I have never tried that. Meanwhile, my less-than-6-months-old computer also runs mandrake effortlessly. All hardware fully functional, and my 5 year old happily playing a game on it as I write this. On Sun, 05 Sep 2004 18:10:28 -0000, Scott Lee <> wrote: > --- In , "Michael Puchol" <mpuchol@s...> wrote: > > it's there. Laptop support in Linux is crap, there are VERY few > models that > > could support any distro out of the box. Three Toshiba and one > Fujitsu I've > > owned have ALL had some problem or other, were it ACPI support, screen, > > graphics card, keyboard strokes auto-repeating themselves if you > didn't type > > at 1 wpm, or any combination of them. > > Huh? I have two laptops -- one old IBM Thinkpad that I own personally > and one relatively new Compaq Evo supplied by my employer. Both work > just fine with linux out of the box -- wireless networking and all. > > Oh, I guess I can think of one problem on my personal laptop and that > is the winmodem doesn't work off the bat. I know that I *could* get > it working but I don't worry about it since I haven't used a modem in > several years. > > --Scott > to unsubscribe, go to http://www.yahoogroups.com and follow the instructions > Yahoo! Groups Links |
Reply by ●September 6, 20042004-09-06
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On Sun, 5 Sep 2004, Wouter van Ooijen wrote: > > I am sure that your .nl has nothing to do with liking Python. :) > > It just might. At university I got a course on ABC, designed by a guy at > the Centre of Mathematics in Amsterdam. IIRC that is where Guido worked, > or at least there was some other connection. ABC had a lot of the ideas > that ended up in Python, including using indendation for nesting. I am > still not sure whether I love or hate that feature. (Hate is more common > when writing code, love when reading. Reading is more important than > writing, so ...) oooh, that's all good software writers forgot to comment the writed code, I think finally I have understood... :)) Vasile |
Reply by ●September 6, 20042004-09-06
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> Anyone know of a good HEX compare program? I found a C++ line > input/output but, ehhhhh, you know. Boring. :-p Maybe Hackman Hex Editor can help: http://www.technologismiki.com/en/index-h.html Since this is Windows application it has exceptional GUI and it might be not so boring as command line interface. Actually, entire Windows is very exceptional OS. I know that because I get this blue "Fatal Exception" screen all the time! :-) Regards, Igor |
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Reply by ●September 6, 20042004-09-06
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Thanks, I will check it out. He he he he. Ya, I know. Love the GUI, but hate the guts. I am still upset that they put the power switches in the most inaccessible place and load windows on the machine. I need that silly switch about 1/2 the time to get back up. Chad --- Igor Janjatovic <> wrote: > > Anyone know of a good HEX compare program? I found a C++ line > > input/output but, ehhhhh, you know. Boring. :-p > > Maybe Hackman Hex Editor can help: > > http://www.technologismiki.com/en/index-h.html > > Since this is Windows application it has exceptional GUI and it might > be not > so boring as command line interface. > > Actually, entire Windows is very exceptional OS. I know that because > I get > this blue "Fatal Exception" screen all the time! :-) > > Regards, > Igor > > ===== My software has no bugs, only undocumented features. __________________________________ |
