--- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> The Lilith project is VERY interesting. It will be
quite easy to
> increase the speed by an order of magnitude. The 64 bit memory will
> be an issue when using FPGA development boards. I'll have to look
> into that.
Most newer boards have 32 bit wide DDR RAM.
So, you wouldn't even notice, just in case you like to write the
controller for it ;-)
cheers
P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
bit wide SRAM to it.
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Small CPUs in FPGAs
Started by ●July 31, 2008
Reply by ●August 10, 20082008-08-10
Reply by ●August 10, 20082008-08-10
--- In f..., "e2kcpu" wrote:
>
> --- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > The Lilith project is VERY interesting. It will be quite easy to
> > increase the speed by an order of magnitude. The 64 bit memory will
> > be an issue when using FPGA development boards. I'll have to look
> > into that.
>
> Most newer boards have 32 bit wide DDR RAM.
> So, you wouldn't even notice, just in case you like to write the
> controller for it ;-)
>
> cheers
>
> P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
> bit wide SRAM to it.
>
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>
> --- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > The Lilith project is VERY interesting. It will be quite easy to
> > increase the speed by an order of magnitude. The 64 bit memory will
> > be an issue when using FPGA development boards. I'll have to look
> > into that.
>
> Most newer boards have 32 bit wide DDR RAM.
> So, you wouldn't even notice, just in case you like to write the
> controller for it ;-)
>
> cheers
>
> P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
> bit wide SRAM to it.
>
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Reply by ●August 10, 20082008-08-10
--- In f..., "e2kcpu" wrote:
>
> --- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > The Lilith project is VERY interesting. It will be quite easy to
> > increase the speed by an order of magnitude. The 64 bit memory will
> > be an issue when using FPGA development boards. I'll have to look
> > into that.
>
> Most newer boards have 32 bit wide DDR RAM.
> So, you wouldn't even notice, just in case you like to write the
> controller for it ;-)
Something went over my head... How do I get from a 32 bit DDR RAM (or
SRAM for that matter) to 64 bit and still have one memory cycle per
access?
> P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
> bit wide SRAM to it.
I'll go on a hunt in a few minutes. The price is not a concern (as
long as I only need one!) but I might not be able to find a
development board. If the device uses a BGA package, it would be a
show-stopper for me.
Richard
>
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>
> --- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > The Lilith project is VERY interesting. It will be quite easy to
> > increase the speed by an order of magnitude. The 64 bit memory will
> > be an issue when using FPGA development boards. I'll have to look
> > into that.
>
> Most newer boards have 32 bit wide DDR RAM.
> So, you wouldn't even notice, just in case you like to write the
> controller for it ;-)
Something went over my head... How do I get from a 32 bit DDR RAM (or
SRAM for that matter) to 64 bit and still have one memory cycle per
access?
> P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
> bit wide SRAM to it.
I'll go on a hunt in a few minutes. The price is not a concern (as
long as I only need one!) but I might not be able to find a
development board. If the device uses a BGA package, it would be a
show-stopper for me.
Richard
>
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Reply by ●August 10, 20082008-08-10
Hi Richard
> Something went over my head... How do I get from a 32 bit DDR RAM (or
> SRAM for that matter) to 64 bit and still have one memory cycle per
> access?
DDR means "Double Data Rate", so each edge of the cycle, one low to high
(rising), and one high to low (falling), gives you 32 bits...both give you
64...so:
2 edges/cycle x 32 bits/edge = 64 bits/cycle
Regards,
Austin
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> Something went over my head... How do I get from a 32 bit DDR RAM (or
> SRAM for that matter) to 64 bit and still have one memory cycle per
> access?
DDR means "Double Data Rate", so each edge of the cycle, one low to high
(rising), and one high to low (falling), gives you 32 bits...both give you
64...so:
2 edges/cycle x 32 bits/edge = 64 bits/cycle
Regards,
Austin
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Reply by ●August 10, 20082008-08-10
--- In f..., "e2kcpu" wrote:
>
> --- In f..., "Rick Collins" wrote:
> >
> > [xr16 ...] was completely published
> > and an LCC port was provided. The gr0040 was not fully documented and
> > the web site even says the compiler was ported, but not provided.
>
> Did you get a response from Jan Gray, if he even thinks about
> releasing the gr0040, gr0050 and tools ?
No word. I have mentioned this in different web groups and I thought
I had sent an email, but I can't seem to find it. I guess I am just
thinking of web posts that were directed to him.
Rick
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>
> --- In f..., "Rick Collins" wrote:
> >
> > [xr16 ...] was completely published
> > and an LCC port was provided. The gr0040 was not fully documented and
> > the web site even says the compiler was ported, but not provided.
>
> Did you get a response from Jan Gray, if he even thinks about
> releasing the gr0040, gr0050 and tools ?
No word. I have mentioned this in different web groups and I thought
I had sent an email, but I can't seem to find it. I guess I am just
thinking of web posts that were directed to him.
Rick
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Reply by ●August 10, 20082008-08-10
--- In f..., "Austin Franklin"
wrote:
>
> Hi Richard
>
> > Something went over my head... How do I get from a 32 bit DDR RAM (or
> > SRAM for that matter) to 64 bit and still have one memory cycle per
> > access?
>
> DDR means "Double Data Rate", so each edge of the cycle, one low to high
> (rising), and one high to low (falling), gives you 32 bits...both
give you
> 64...so:
>
> 2 edges/cycle x 32 bits/edge = 64 bits/cycle
>
> Regards,
>
> Austin
>
Ah...(slap forehead, etc)
I'll look at the Digilent offerings and see what's available.
Richard
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wrote:
>
> Hi Richard
>
> > Something went over my head... How do I get from a 32 bit DDR RAM (or
> > SRAM for that matter) to 64 bit and still have one memory cycle per
> > access?
>
> DDR means "Double Data Rate", so each edge of the cycle, one low to high
> (rising), and one high to low (falling), gives you 32 bits...both
give you
> 64...so:
>
> 2 edges/cycle x 32 bits/edge = 64 bits/cycle
>
> Regards,
>
> Austin
>
Ah...(slap forehead, etc)
I'll look at the Digilent offerings and see what's available.
Richard
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Reply by ●August 11, 20082008-08-11
--- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
> > bit wide SRAM to it.
>
> I'll go on a hunt in a few minutes. The price is not a concern (as
> long as I only need one!) but I might not be able to find a
> development board. If the device uses a BGA package, it would be a
> show-stopper for me.
It uses an FPGA package. The reason I mentioned it is, the FPGA on it
is a Spartan3-DSP and has already 1.5 MBit Blockram. It should be
enough for a lot of uCode & Code ...
So not external memory needed for the start.
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> > P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just add 64
> > bit wide SRAM to it.
>
> I'll go on a hunt in a few minutes. The price is not a concern (as
> long as I only need one!) but I might not be able to find a
> development board. If the device uses a BGA package, it would be a
> show-stopper for me.
It uses an FPGA package. The reason I mentioned it is, the FPGA on it
is a Spartan3-DSP and has already 1.5 MBit Blockram. It should be
enough for a lot of uCode & Code ...
So not external memory needed for the start.
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Reply by ●August 11, 20082008-08-11
--- In f..., "e2kcpu" wrote:
>
> --- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > > P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just
add 64
> > > bit wide SRAM to it.
> >
> > I'll go on a hunt in a few minutes. The price is not a concern (as
> > long as I only need one!) but I might not be able to find a
> > development board. If the device uses a BGA package, it would be a
> > show-stopper for me.
>
> It uses an FPGA package. The reason I mentioned it is, the FPGA on it
> is a Spartan3-DSP and has already 1.5 MBit Blockram. It should be
> enough for a lot of uCode & Code ...
> So not external memory needed for the start.
>
I found the Spartan 3A Starter Board on the Xilinx site. As you said,
it has everything necessary for a project like this.
Using the Avnet System ACE Module saves the design effort for creating
a Compact Flash device for the file system. $125.
The Lilith project requires 32k 64-bit quadwords so the Spartan 3A DSP
BlockRAM is not quite large enough. But it is large enough for
another project I have built where I shortchanged the RAM to avoid
using the onboard SRAM (I always intended to revisit this issue).
Assuming I can find a DDR core, there is more than enough DDR RAM on
the board so I can see where this could become my new favorite board.
I'm going to re-synthesize my old project for the new chip and see how
it comes out. It should fit easily!
Thanks for the info!
Richard
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>
> --- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> > > P.S. The other "doable" is the XILINX-DSP platform ($295). Just
add 64
> > > bit wide SRAM to it.
> >
> > I'll go on a hunt in a few minutes. The price is not a concern (as
> > long as I only need one!) but I might not be able to find a
> > development board. If the device uses a BGA package, it would be a
> > show-stopper for me.
>
> It uses an FPGA package. The reason I mentioned it is, the FPGA on it
> is a Spartan3-DSP and has already 1.5 MBit Blockram. It should be
> enough for a lot of uCode & Code ...
> So not external memory needed for the start.
>
I found the Spartan 3A Starter Board on the Xilinx site. As you said,
it has everything necessary for a project like this.
Using the Avnet System ACE Module saves the design effort for creating
a Compact Flash device for the file system. $125.
The Lilith project requires 32k 64-bit quadwords so the Spartan 3A DSP
BlockRAM is not quite large enough. But it is large enough for
another project I have built where I shortchanged the RAM to avoid
using the onboard SRAM (I always intended to revisit this issue).
Assuming I can find a DDR core, there is more than enough DDR RAM on
the board so I can see where this could become my new favorite board.
I'm going to re-synthesize my old project for the new chip and see how
it comes out. It should fit easily!
Thanks for the info!
Richard
To post a message, send it to: f...
To unsubscribe, send a blank message to: f...
Reply by ●August 11, 20082008-08-11
--- In f..., "rtstofer" wrote:
> The Lilith project requires 32k 64-bit quadwords so the Spartan 3A DSP
> BlockRAM is not quite large enough. But it is large enough for
> another project I have built where I shortchanged the RAM to avoid
> using the onboard SRAM (I always intended to revisit this issue).
>
> Assuming I can find a DDR core, there is more than enough DDR RAM on
> the board so I can see where this could become my new favorite board.
That's the tough part. Nobody published a DDR2 Core yet !
> I'm going to re-synthesize my old project for the new chip and see how
> it comes out. It should fit easily!
PDP or the cpm system ?
BTW, I'm thinking of making EXP-SRAM board. 64 bit wide, and also some
C and SD-flash connectors.
Cheers
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> The Lilith project requires 32k 64-bit quadwords so the Spartan 3A DSP
> BlockRAM is not quite large enough. But it is large enough for
> another project I have built where I shortchanged the RAM to avoid
> using the onboard SRAM (I always intended to revisit this issue).
>
> Assuming I can find a DDR core, there is more than enough DDR RAM on
> the board so I can see where this could become my new favorite board.
That's the tough part. Nobody published a DDR2 Core yet !
> I'm going to re-synthesize my old project for the new chip and see how
> it comes out. It should fit easily!
PDP or the cpm system ?
BTW, I'm thinking of making EXP-SRAM board. 64 bit wide, and also some
C and SD-flash connectors.
Cheers
To post a message, send it to: f...
To unsubscribe, send a blank message to: f...
Reply by ●August 11, 20082008-08-11
--- In f..., "e2kcpu" wrote:
> > I'm going to re-synthesize my old project for the new chip and see
how
> > it comes out. It should fit easily!
>
> PDP or the cpm system ?
IBM1130 - the first computer I ever used programmed, circa 1969.
I started looking at the PDP project and coded the ALU but somehow the
project never really caught my fancy. Running Unix V6 would be a trip
but other projects got in the way.
>
> BTW, I'm thinking of making EXP-SRAM board. 64 bit wide, and also some
> C and SD-flash connectors.
>
Given the number of user IO lines (168) on the Spartan 3A DSP Starter
Board, it is probably quite easy to add SRAM. I'm not sure where to
get the mating Samtec connectors.
I guess I would build a 'bridge' board for SRAM and a Compact Flash
device.
Leaving the internal BlockRAM unused (for the most part) makes me want
to build a logic analyzer into the project. Something along the lines
of http://www.sump.org/projects/analyzer/
Richard
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> > I'm going to re-synthesize my old project for the new chip and see
how
> > it comes out. It should fit easily!
>
> PDP or the cpm system ?
IBM1130 - the first computer I ever used programmed, circa 1969.
I started looking at the PDP project and coded the ALU but somehow the
project never really caught my fancy. Running Unix V6 would be a trip
but other projects got in the way.
>
> BTW, I'm thinking of making EXP-SRAM board. 64 bit wide, and also some
> C and SD-flash connectors.
>
Given the number of user IO lines (168) on the Spartan 3A DSP Starter
Board, it is probably quite easy to add SRAM. I'm not sure where to
get the mating Samtec connectors.
I guess I would build a 'bridge' board for SRAM and a Compact Flash
device.
Leaving the internal BlockRAM unused (for the most part) makes me want
to build a logic analyzer into the project. Something along the lines
of http://www.sump.org/projects/analyzer/
Richard
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