Good Hardware Tools

> And they maintain -5..+5 degrees Fahrenheit - not exactly "sub zero"
> as the name implies, but way below freezing.

Funny, to me "sub-zero" just means below freezing. I have to really 
try and remember what temperature, Fahrenheit, water freezes at!

Anybody know of any other countries than the USA that habitually use 
Fahrenheit? I'm just curious. The UK used to, and no doubt there are 
many "older" UK people who still use it - but all weather reports etc 
give temp. in centigrade.

Stef <stef33d@yahooI-N-V-A-L-I-D.com.invalid> wrote:
> On 2020-11-17 Rick C wrote in comp.arch.embedded:
> 
>> Durn this GG UI...  Every time I scroll down a bit to read something, as
>> soon as I start typing it scrolls up to put my typing at the very top of
>> the screen.  What is wrong with Google that they would spend time to
>> rewrite the GG UI, making it worse in the process when no one was
>> complaining about how it works?  I've noticed any number of changes that
>> simply make the UI less usable with no redeeming quality.  
>> 
> 
> I see you complain a lot about GG so why not switch to a decent newsreader?
> (That would get rid of the afwul GG line lengths as well ;-) )
> 
> If it is because you would then need news server access, there are free
> options. There are also paid services that are really cheap if you only use
> text newsgroups. The one I am using costs me Euro 1,70 a year because that is
> the minimum year fee they have. If it were only for the amount data, I could
> probably do with one tenth of that.
> 

Here is a free Usenet feed for text groups:

news.eternal-september.org

I use NewsTap on an iPad connected to this.

In article <1cfad111-9bba-408a-8168-a9221891ec1dn@googlegroups.com>,
Rick C  <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Friday, November 13, 2020 at 6:11:08 PM UTC-5, Kent Dickey wrote:
>> It looks like the PicoScope 6000 new is 5GSa/s at 500MHz with 2 channels 
>> for $6916. The 25 year old HP equipment is almost as good (half the 
>> sampling rate) for 1/10th the price. 
>> 
>Thanks for the suggestions.  I used one of those HP logic analyzers
>complete with a floppy disk drive, MANY years ago.  You picked the top
>end PicoScope to compare to.  The problem is the HP16500 would barely
>fit in my car without breaking an axle while the PicoScope will fit in
>my computer bag!  

I picked the cheapest PicoScope that seemed to match the HP capabilities.
It is not the most expensive PicoScope.  That seems to be the PicoScope
9400 at $19,495, but it does 2.5TSa/sec sampling with 16GHz bandwidth
(looks like it's for PCIe-type signals).  It's called SXRTO, and I'm not
really familiar with how they work (it's strongly implied they are "cheating"
at the sampling rate).

The HP scope bandwidth is 500MHz, and that's out of the range of cheap
scopes.  PicoScope does give you 5GSa/sec (compared to HP 2GSa/sec), but
that's just because they don't have a 2GSa/sec scope.  But you can't look at
fast edges (say 1ns) on a scope with 100MHz bandwidth since it filtered all
the signal of interest away.  It's probably passable on a scope with 300MHz
of bandwidth (PicoScope says the rise time of signals can be < 1.3ns for
300MHz bandwidth, and < 850ps for 500MHz.  That feels about right).  That
moves the PicoScope price down to $4556.  I also didn't include the scope
probe price, which is $300-$389 for two.

This HP equipment is heavy, but it can be carried by one person.  It's
basically the size of a full-size PC tower with about 30% more depth.
It runs off 110V with a "normal" plug, so it's not that bad power-wise.
Running it for an hour even if it drew a continous 15Amp (and it does not)
would only be 1.6kWhours = 40 cents.  I generally only need a scope for a
few hours at a time.

If you need a more portable scope, with fewer features, old legacy versions of
these also are available, I just don't know anything about them.

Kent

On 17/11/2020 23:28, Jim Jackson wrote:
>> And they maintain -5..+5 degrees Fahrenheit - not exactly "sub zero"
>> as the name implies, but way below freezing.
> 
> Funny, to me "sub-zero" just means below freezing. I have to really 
> try and remember what temperature, Fahrenheit, water freezes at!
> 
> Anybody know of any other countries than the USA that habitually use 
> Fahrenheit? I'm just curious. The UK used to, and no doubt there are 
> many "older" UK people who still use it - but all weather reports etc 
> give temp. in centigrade.
> 

It is still used colloquially in the UK for warm weather (like saying
"it's in the nineties" to mean it is hot), and probably by some older
people for oven temperatures.  At least it's a step up from gas marks...

A few tiny countries (typically ex-British colonies in the Caribbean)
still have weather reports in Fahrenheit, as they get them all from the
USA.  And I guess older folks there occasionally use it, like in the UK.

But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as
standard.

On 18.11.20 12.11, David Brown wrote:
> On 17/11/2020 23:28, Jim Jackson wrote:
>>> And they maintain -5..+5 degrees Fahrenheit - not exactly "sub zero"
>>> as the name implies, but way below freezing.
>>
>> Funny, to me "sub-zero" just means below freezing. I have to really
>> try and remember what temperature, Fahrenheit, water freezes at!
>>
>> Anybody know of any other countries than the USA that habitually use
>> Fahrenheit? I'm just curious. The UK used to, and no doubt there are
>> many "older" UK people who still use it - but all weather reports etc
>> give temp. in centigrade.
>>
> 
> It is still used colloquially in the UK for warm weather (like saying
> "it's in the nineties" to mean it is hot), and probably by some older
> people for oven temperatures.  At least it's a step up from gas marks...
> 
> A few tiny countries (typically ex-British colonies in the Caribbean)
> still have weather reports in Fahrenheit, as they get them all from the
> USA.  And I guess older folks there occasionally use it, like in the UK.
> 
> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as
> standard.


The US Congress decided in 1866 to go metric - a little
sluggish implementation.

-- 

-TV

On Tuesday, November 17, 2020 at 5:28:23 PM UTC-5, Jim Jackson wrote:
> > And they maintain -5..+5 degrees Fahrenheit - not exactly "sub zero" 
> > as the name implies, but way below freezing.
> Funny, to me "sub-zero" just means below freezing. I have to really 
> try and remember what temperature, Fahrenheit, water freezes at! 
> 
> Anybody know of any other countries than the USA that habitually use 
> Fahrenheit? I'm just curious. The UK used to, and no doubt there are 
> many "older" UK people who still use it - but all weather reports etc 
> give temp. in centigrade.

We don't use Fahrenheit in the US, we abuse it. 

-- 

  Rick C.

  ++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  ++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209 

On Tuesday, November 17, 2020 at 11:56:41 PM UTC-5, Kent Dickey wrote:
> In article <1cfad111-9bba-408a...@googlegroups.com>,
> Rick C <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> >On Friday, November 13, 2020 at 6:11:08 PM UTC-5, Kent Dickey wrote: 
> >> It looks like the PicoScope 6000 new is 5GSa/s at 500MHz with 2 channels 
> >> for $6916. The 25 year old HP equipment is almost as good (half the 
> >> sampling rate) for 1/10th the price. 
> >>
> >Thanks for the suggestions. I used one of those HP logic analyzers 
> >complete with a floppy disk drive, MANY years ago. You picked the top 
> >end PicoScope to compare to. The problem is the HP16500 would barely 
> >fit in my car without breaking an axle while the PicoScope will fit in 
> >my computer bag!
> I picked the cheapest PicoScope that seemed to match the HP capabilities. 
> It is not the most expensive PicoScope. That seems to be the PicoScope 
> 9400 at $19,495, but it does 2.5TSa/sec sampling with 16GHz bandwidth 
> (looks like it's for PCIe-type signals). It's called SXRTO, and I'm not 
> really familiar with how they work (it's strongly implied they are "cheating" 
> at the sampling rate). 
> 
> The HP scope bandwidth is 500MHz, and that's out of the range of cheap 
> scopes. PicoScope does give you 5GSa/sec (compared to HP 2GSa/sec), but 
> that's just because they don't have a 2GSa/sec scope. But you can't look at 
> fast edges (say 1ns) on a scope with 100MHz bandwidth since it filtered all 
> the signal of interest away. It's probably passable on a scope with 300MHz 
> of bandwidth (PicoScope says the rise time of signals can be < 1.3ns for 
> 300MHz bandwidth, and < 850ps for 500MHz. That feels about right). That 
> moves the PicoScope price down to $4556. I also didn't include the scope 
> probe price, which is $300-$389 for two. 
> 
> This HP equipment is heavy, but it can be carried by one person. It's 
> basically the size of a full-size PC tower with about 30% more depth. 
> It runs off 110V with a "normal" plug, so it's not that bad power-wise. 
> Running it for an hour even if it drew a continous 15Amp (and it does not) 
> would only be 1.6kWhours = 40 cents. I generally only need a scope for a 
> few hours at a time. 
> 
> If you need a more portable scope, with fewer features, old legacy versions of 
> these also are available, I just don't know anything about them. 

You aren't getting it.  A box the size of a sewing machine and twice as heavy is not in any way comparable to a device about the size of a good book.  Not interested in sewing machine light either.  But I appreciate the attempt to help.  So far I've gone a few years now without actually needing to buy a scope.  Working on FPGAs where the code is 99.9% debugged in simulation is a big help.  The other 0.1% can be debugged on the customer's bench where they have some really nice tools.  

-- 

  Rick C.

  --- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  --- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

On 2020-11-18 12:40, Tauno Voipio wrote:
> On 18.11.20 12.11, David Brown wrote:
    ...
>>
>> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as
>> standard.
> 
> 
> The US Congress decided in 1866 to go metric - a little
> sluggish implementation.


Sometimes described by saying that the "US is inching its way towards 
the metric system."

David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes:
> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as
> standard.

Automotive speed limits in every country I've visited are posted in
miles per hour or kilometers per hour.  Metric units would of course be
meters per second (100 km/hour is about 28 m/sec).

Me, I support switching to the FFF (Furlong-Firkin-Fortnight) system.
For example, the speed of light is about 1.8e12 furlongs per fortnight.

;-)

Am 18.11.2020 um 13:51 schrieb Niklas Holsti:

> Sometimes described by saying that the "US is inching its way towards 
> the metric system."

The term "inching" may no longer really doing it justice.  Let's do some 
(metric) math on this.  The total of the borders and coastlines of the 
mainland USA is roughly twenty thousand miles, or 32 thousand 
kilometers.  And it has been 154 years since that decision.

So to travel around the entire mainland US since then, the average speed 
would have been, roughly:

	208 km per year,
	570 meters per day, or
	24 meters per hour

For comparison a turtle is reported to be going 330 m/h.  It could thus 
have run circles around the mainland U.S.  Like: literally 15 times around.

Or, speaking of "sluggish": an actual slug (i.e. a garden-variety snail) 
can clock in at around 3 m/h.  That's fast enough for it to have "run" 
the entire U.S.-Mexico border in that time faster than the U.S.A. took 
to cross from the silly to the sane side of same.

It's a paradox: a country that was founded on the very principle of 
abolishing, with prejudice, everything British is now just about the 
last one on earth still sticking to these fundamentally British 
Imperial(!) units --- except Great Britain itself.  Who in turn just 
won't agree with the French on anything if they can possibly help it.